PCLA Accuracy .45 Colt

[JDBraddy]

I just bought a Winchester 94AE in .45 Colt. and am getting frustrated trying to get her to shoot like I think it sould. I'm getting roughly four inch groups from the bench at 50yds. I understand this isn't a benchrest rifle, but my rimfires will do 1/2 inch or less, off the bench at that distance. At first I though my sights might be the problem. I purchased and installed a Lyman 17A front sight globe and a Williams TK Foolproof rear, Then I thought ammo might be the problem, I've tried multiple bullet / powder combinations, cast lead, molly coated, jacketed bullets, of various weights and designs from 200gr to 300gr, I even bough and tried various brands of factory ammo, and saw little difference. So farr, I've had best results and more or less settled on a lead 255gr RNFP on top of 7.8gr Unique wich chronographs an average of 1040fps with a spread ranging plus or minus 20fps. It will tease me and several rounds in a cluster all touching, then throw a couple 3-4 inches from the group. Those of you out there who have experience, do I have unrealistic expectations thinking this rifle should be capible of consistantly producing one inch groups at 50 yds from the bench? If so, your thoughts and suggestions on how to get there from here, would be greatly appreciated.

[snaketail2]

I've been down that road and I'm still weaving around trying to find the best route.
I'm still looking and experimenting, but the best solution to accuracy I've found is seat the bullet out further than normal. Seat them longer than you would for a revolver.
This might not be the final solution, but it's the best I have for now.
I also added a tighter crimp and that seemed to improve things a little.

"This week" my best load is a 230gr RNFP Jacketed bullet over 10.3g of AA5. But I'm still testing and hoping to find a better shooting load. (Powder is still hard for find in the small market where I live. We have to shoot what we find in the store.) Rams are 2.5 min up from Pig setting.

I'll be watching this post.

Michael

[JDBraddy]

Will try seating some out longer, not sure if I can seat them out far enough to touch the lands and still have them function through the rifles action. Also, my RCBS Carbide Die set did not come with a crimp die, it came with a resize die, expander/powder die, and a seating die. Will probably have to buy a crimp dies seperately.

[twidpa]

I also went down this road. Even sent the rifle back to the factory. They sent back a target with a 1 inch group (maybe 10 feet distance who knows) but they said to try the federal 250 grain lead factory loads. They did group well so I pulled one and matched the powder type by sight and weighed a charge. I used this info to get reloads with OK accuracy but not great accuracy. I eventually gave up on the PCLA 45 colt thing. Moved on to the hyphenated little guys and never looked back.
T

[w30wcf]

JD,
What bullet and diameter are you using? If you are not using .454+" diameter bullets try some and only neck size the cases. Remington offfers a .455" diameter bullet and those have shot extremely well from my rifle as have the .454" Magtechs (much better than the Magtech reviews).
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/160144 ... round-nose
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/165731 ... -flat-nose

Most .45 Colts have generous chambers and thus a full length sized cartridge is typically lying .004 - .005" below the center of the bore.
By neck sizing and leaving the case mouth expanded, the bullet is more in line with the bore.

Neck sized, uncrimped ammo in my .45 Colt will group in 2" - 3" at 100 if I do my part.

Good luck,
w30wcf

[Taps]

G'day from the Game Ranch.
I recently acquired a Win 94AE in .45 long colt for use in PCCLA.
I have been using 9 grains of AS50 ( don't know if there is an equivalent in the U.S ) behind
cast bullets of 230 and 250 grains, RNFP.
This will give me 2- 2.5 inch groups @ 100m which is as good as I can get with any of my open-sighted rifles.
I'd also slug the bore, my rifle has a very tight .450 bore.
I like the balance of this rifle with the 24" barrel , it "feels" right to me.

[snaketail2]

I wanted to try a larger diameter bullet - .454 vs .452. But nothing locally in that size.
I looked all over the net and finally found some .454 cast bullets that were actually "in-stock". So I ordered a box. Later I looked at my order again and I had found I had ordered 250gr .454 that were lubed for Black Powder!

Does this mean I bought soft lead bullets too? Anything wrong with shooting these in a cartridge rifle?


M

[snaketail2]

Today I was shot 250gr .454 boolits in my Rossi .454 Casull with a 20" barrel.

I only shot at 50 yards, but the results were far superior to the .452 Boolits I've been using. The point of impact was slightly down and to the left of my previous marks. But, they were all in a tight group - maybe 2".
Amazing how .002 can make a difference in accuracy and placement. Thanks for the suggestions - I'm going to stick with this load.
Michael

PS: the boolits were from Chey in Cheyenne. Wy. I'll be ordering more soon.

[JDBraddy]

I finally made some progress today! I've tried everything in this rifle, Molly coat, cast Lead, Jacketed, heavier 300 and 350 grain bullets, multiple powders, light loads, hot loads, Loading them long, short, just touching the lands, jamming them into the lands, just a couple thousanths short of the lands. I've put almost 1000 rounds through this rifle already trying to get it to shoot, and was considering selling it and trying something else, nothing seemed to work untill today, I realized the twist rate on this rifle is 1 in 16, wich is really slow compared to my other centerfires. I'd been trying heavier and heavier bullets, but remebered, slow twist rate = lighter bullets, so I tried some lighter bullets....0.452" 185 JHP's and 200gr Molly coated lead RNFP's that I use in my .45acp. Group sizes instantly went from three inches at 50yds, to about an inch at 50yds. Then I tried some with 6.0gr Unique, and some with 10.0gr unique, the hotter loads shot better. I'll keep experimenting, need to get some 230 grainers to try, but right now the 200gr molly RNFP's are the best I've tried, with the slow twist rate, lighter bullets seem to have made the difference.

[snaketail2]

Please keep us posted. I imagine a lot of .45 rifle shooters are interested in your results.
Are you getting any leading with the 200gr boolits?
M

[JDBraddy]

My frustration got the better of me, traded it off yesterday.

[snaketail2]

I did the same with my first wife...but then I got a newer and better one.