First Match 10 years old

[kevinpagano]

Hi all I am taking my 10 year old to his first match this Sunday. He has shot very little Silhouette but really wants to try a match. My question is that it is a 60 shot match and I do not want him to get too tired. I was thinking about just having him shoot hunter rifle and spot for his brother on standard. What do all of you think?

Kevin

[carl425]

Did you say "tired" and "10-year old" in the same sentence?

I have never taught a 10-year old to shoot silhouette, but I used to coach a lot of little league baseball. I had a 5 gallon bucket of balls that we used to use for batting practice. In addition to all the fielding and base running drills, each kid was pitched a full bucket of balls to hit. On the days when the next team that had the field didn't show up, everybody got a second bucket. No body ever complained of being tired.

For a 10-year old, shooting has to rank several notches above "my turn at bat". Spotting probably ranks right up there with policing the outfield to make sure we didn't lose any balls. I doubt a kid that age that's never shot a match can spot well enough to do any good for the shooter anyway.

I'd vote for letting him shoot them all. Ask him after the first 60 if he wants to go again and let him decide. I'll bet he'll be up for a 3rd set if you give him the chance.

[propwash]

a youngsters upper body at 10 may not have the endurance for 60 rounds offhand...If he will shoot all offhand I think his arms won't be much good after 60 and will be jerking shots just so he can bring the gun down. This is where my son has issues....He's 13 but a pretty skinny kid shooting an 8+lb CZ varmint. I agree with the previous poster that a 10 year old won't do you much good as a spotter but they can load the hell out of some clips for yah. If he is not already in a youth shooting program I would suggest a jr. air rifle club somewhere. This will teach him positions, sighting experience and the ability to call his shots. We can teach them too but what kid listens to their parents? It is also cool to see the instructers reinforce everything we have taught them.

[Pete A.]

nt

[steel_ram]

If the kid gets discouraged, ask the match director (if it's just a club match) if he can use a rest. Obviously the score can't officially count, and the youth should be aware what the rule's really are, but as said, it's got to be fun in a "yippy" kind of way at that age.

[mordecai]

My 12 year old can use a super-light weight rifle for a 60-shot match and tires with an 8lb rifle by 40 shots.

I personally am pooped by the third animal when shooting both classes, but that's me being out-of-shape.

[CWS]

Both daughters were shooting from a very early age, but we didn't let them compete in any large matches until they turned 12. Nothing magical about the age... in our case it was a matter of motor skills and safety. At small local matches they were fine because they had ample supervision but larger matches were just too much for my nerves. I don't mind the "Daddy where's my gun, shells, ear muffs, glasses, sunscreen, etc..." but no one should have to look down their muzzles or worry about whether or not the rifle is loaded. (They're in their mid-twenties now and I STILL hear " where's my...." but I don't care. They're my kids enjoying the sport with me.) Until the precautions are second nature with them they should stick with smaller venues that are more manageable. Otherwise one of two cases will exist... either you won't be having any fun due to worry, or WE won't have any fun for the same reason. "Johnny, don't point your rifle at Mr. Ward's back while he's trying to shoot. It takes him off his game."

[atomicbrh]

Kevin, my son who will be 15 next month and is about 6 foot 2 inches tall now started Smallbore Silhouette at age nine. My son had played many organized sports from age 3 up to age 12 and was extremely strong but tall and thin. In the third grade he ran 7 miles cross country for a Church School Fundraiser in less than an hour. He played tournament baseball after the regular season in 100+ degree temperatures. At age 11 he was a very dominant baseball pitcher winning 16 games and never leaving the mound with less than a 4 run lead when league pitching rules forced him to stop pitching. Many sides were out with 10 and 11 pitches. All this boring information about the child's strength is to back up my following statements. At age 9 and 10 my extremely strong son could shoot practice and two 40 round matchs without any trouble but he was shooting a Savage Mark II in a synthetic stock with a Small BSA Target scope of some description that I cannot remember. This rifle with scope and mounts is tiny and probably did not weigh over 6 pounds. The whole rig cost me less than $120. I will mention that from early on my son had good natural bone on bone support of his rifle. He has never used muscle to hold the front of his rifle up. At age 11, he moved up to a CZ 452 American Classic with a Tasco 10-40 and then switched to a Weaver T-36. The Spring of 2006 he switched to a 1712 in a Mcmillan stock because the CZ was just too small and light. In the middle of the 2006 season due to a tremendous growth spurt he switched to another Anschutz 1700 series in a stock about 1 inch longer in pull than the standard Mcmillan 1712 Hunter Stock. Now my son's rifle is so long and the scope is so far away that I cannot zero it or shoot it. The point I am working to is that from experience with my son most 9 and 10 year olds need a much lighter, smaller rifle than anyone can imagine for standing silhouette. The little guys need a rifle that feels way too light in practice because by the time they get to the last few banks of the last match they will be very fatigued and the super light rifle will be just right. Ounces and where those ounces are located on the rifle is critical to a youngster. Never underestimate how short a length of pull they need either. I always emphasized the mental toughness that silhouette requires in a quiet way on the way to the matchs when he was small. Not to put pressure on him to shoot high scores when he was small but the mental toughness to put up with 6 out of 40, 8 out of 40, 9 out of 40 type scores for the first few years until he got big enough and experienced enough to shoot higher scores. We really celebrated when one of us shot in the double digits those first two seasons. I have always been proud of him because he never shot off of a rest a single time in his life when he could have being so small(No disrespect meant to Pete A's young Samuel). Even at a young age he wanted to follow the Official Match rules and have his scores put in his Scorebook. At a local match one time a girl a few years older and about twice his size shot a 40 out of 40 sitting at a bench with rests and rear bag set by her father for each animal with a Standard Heavy rifle. My son shot in the single digits in both Hunter and Smallbore rifle. After the match, the girl's father asked us if his daughter could try Joel's rifle in the standing position. The daughter could not even hold the little Savage in the standing position much less squeeze off a shot. That day Joel was very proud of his single digit scores. After that incident of 40 off the bench the club putting on the match never offered for anyone to shoot off the bench again. I also wanted to describe these experiences to illustrate how difficult it is to keep a growing boy in a properly fitted rifle and what difficulty I had providing a rifle that fit him at each stage of growth. I have great admiration for the 9, 10 and 11 year olds that shoot this sport because it takes a great deal of determination for them to shoot in the standing position.

I hope this helps.
Bobby R. Huddleston

[mordecai]

Well atomicbrh, if you wanted the "Best Damn Answer for the Month of Febuary" all you had to do was ask! Way to be!

[kevinpagano]

Thanks for all the information. It looks like we may not get to shoot as there is still difficulty getting to the range. Match may be canceled. I forgot to mention he is shooting a CZ Scout. After working with him today. I will let him shoot just the 40 or 60. I think he will get too tired for the whole match. If he isnt tired after the 60 then I will sign him up for the rest. You all gave me great info. Wow Bobby now that was detailed thanks alot.

Kevin

[atomicbrh]

Kevin, I also wanted to mention that you cannot put the desire to shoot in competition into another person: adult or child. You probably already knew this. The child or adult must have a very strong desire or as some athletes say "Stay Hungry" to shoot and keep improving. From the age of 6 or 7 my son wanted to shoot something in competition. Due to the kind of work I do my son has grown up around lots of people retired from or in the 20th Special Forces and I think he picked up the interest in the shooting sports from them. I called the 4H people in our area about their shooting programs, even volunteered to go to classes to be a 4H coach and they just basically ignored me. We went to all different kinds of matchs to watch and find out what my son could participate in at such a young age. Highpower across the course was just too expensive, loud and complicated for a little kid but he especially enjoyed watching the Rapid Fire strings of Highpower. He would even walk back and forth to the targets with the competitors to see how they scored and who was shooting the best. Even highpower Service rifles have terribly short barrel life. We went to a Smallbore prone match and even bought a prone Smallbore rifle but he just never liked the hot Coats and sweat shirts that helped you shoot well in Prone. We also watched a NRA Bullseye Pistol Match but that was too expensive and we learned that it is bad for a youngster's arm and shoulder to shoot one-handed with a heavy pistol until they reach age 15 or 16. IPSC/USPSA was out because the matchs in our area were held on Sunday Mornings and we do not like to miss church. When I say many of the disciplines we looked at were too expensive, I mean from a barrel life, ammo reloading, ammo cost perspective. Then I saw in USA Shooting Sports magazine that Smallbore Rifle Silhouette Matchs were being held monthly in Woolmarket, Mississippi by Tom Hill. I contacted Tom and he sent me instructions on how to get to the range which was a 3 hour drive from home. I drove down with some friends a few times and watched the matchs. Then I bought the little Savage with the BSA scope and shot the next match myself. My son practiced on paper with the little Savage at our home range which did not hold Silhouette Matchs and shot the next match at Woolmarket. It took a lot of determination for a 9 year old to get up before 5 A.M. on Saturday mornings, drive 3 hours and shoot the local matchs. Tom Hill and the people at Coast Rifle & Pistol Club along with folks from Southeast Louisiana and Southwest Alabama that ran and shot matchs in that area helped us tremendously to get started in this sport. We started to shoot Jerry Tureau's matchs in Gonzales, LA. on the fourth Saturday of the Month which is also another 3 hour drive from home. I knew that Joel had a strong desire to shoot when he began staying late into the afternoon to practice and spot with Jerry Tureau after everyone else had left and the wind really started playing havoc with the bullet. We learned very quickly that Smallbore Rifle Silhouette was a viable shooting discipline from which many things could be learned because it was not an equipment race like many of the other shooting sports. I liked the fact that you cannot buy your way into a high score in Rifle Silhouette.

Another feature that I really liked about Smallbore Rifle Silhouette is the safety factor that the rifles stay in a vertical rack when you go down range and the parent can handle the rifle at critical times carrying the rifle to the firing line and then back to the rack after the child has fired his last shot at a bank of animals. The parent can legally set parallax and elevation(and/or windage) for the next animal distance for the child when the child has fired his last shot at a bank. But the child is on his own between the Ready command and his last shot or the Cease Fire command. When you think about it the course of fire rules are just right for a parent to start a 9, 10, or 11 year-old in the shooting sports. You must stay right with them at this age though. It is a many year process to teach them all the things that are required to even shoot before match practice safely without supervision. The long process is worth it though because shooting in competition teachs a child some things that I cannot really describe. You are forced to spend so much one on one time with them because you and the child know that unlike ball sports just one little lapse in safety procedures can kill or injure and that would take all joy out of a sport forever that they love. It is unspoken most times but there is that point in time after thousands of hours practicing, shooting and travelling to matchs together that it dawns on the parent that the child has all the skills necessary to see him or her through a Match safely. Innocent Mary was right when she said there are some things a child cannot learn in a classroom.

The one thing I do not understand is the folks at our local range who say they want to shoot silhouette but will not even make the effort to drive to one of the best ranges in the country, Winnsboro Gun Club which is just an hour and forty minute drive away. In the past year I have done everything that was needed to bring Smallbore Silhouette to our local range. The berms and rails are in place at the precise distances required. We have a new firing line cover and beautiful brand new animals from Ray Schafer. All the paperwork has been done. We are exactly four weeks away from the first Smallbore Rifle Silhouette Match ever held in Central Mississippi. We have not seen a single person practicing or getting ready to shoot the matchs. I have had only one person call and ask about what equipment is required and express a genuine interest in shooting the matchs. I do not understand what is so difficult about driving to and participating in a Silhouette Match. All of us on this forum do it all the time and cannot wait for the season to start each Spring. Are they afraid to shoot a Match ? If so what are they afraid of?

Bobby R. Huddleston

[kevinpagano]

Bobby, I have went through many of the things your talking about. I have shot ipsc, trap, sporting clays, idpa etc. My boys like shooting all guns and really enjoyed trap. If you have ever shot trap competitively you will understand the money and time invested in that sport. Just not viable for us as a family. Besides my wife likes shooting small bore and it will be easier to get her to travel somewhere to a smallbore match.

When I started shooting last year we had 3 matches a month all on Sundays. Church was an issue immediately. The local guys have them on sundays because they seem to get more participation, and it works with thier schedule. I have since joined a gun club and we are having practice matches on the first saturday for six months a year. I can get away 1 sunday a month but not many more. I hope to have NRA matches by next year. Our range isnt anything fancy. Berms, Stands, non covered shooting line and lots of wind. We did get about 8 shooters toward the end of the year but 4 were my family. We are going to improve the target stands and try to get to local gun shows and promote the sport. I would be interested what kinds of difficulties you have getting rolling. I think a big thing for us is going to be a covered level shooting line.

Kevin

[atomicbrh]

Kevin, You have a PM.

Bobby R. Huddleston

[kevinpagano]

Bobby so do you.


My 10 year old shot a 4/40 this weekend with his CZ scout. I was proud of him and his 12 year old brother that shot a 10/40 with his american. I shot a 21 which is about avg. for me. The wind was zero the temp was about 50 deg. But the animals were black because of the snow and the chickens were hard to see because the snow melted and had a dark brown dirt background. We had a great time as usual and Dave Bonner from aurora, co puts on a fun match. Thanks Dave!

Kevin

[jeff59]

Kevin,

Which range did you shoot at this weekend?
I wanted to get out for my first match but I thought
snow was covering everything in Colorado.