Add weight to a Marlin 45/70 cowboy ?

[boats]

Couple of questions, Rule book does not say anything about adding weight, Is it legal ? If so has anybody added a few pounds. No doubt 38/55's in the Cowboy are going to recoil less and shoot easier however they are not real available. 45/70 even with light loads kicks a lot. Bring that Marlin up to 9 Lbs or so it would be more controllable.

All comment appreciated

Boats

[silhouette13]

i can see no issues according to the rules. should be ok, have at it
ido agree i would rather be a little tired atfter an 80rd match than sore and flinching, 40-80 rds of 45/70 is something!

dave

[Jason]

Adding a couple pounds of weight to the butt would definitely help recoil without causing too much fatigue. It would also help balance the gun better if you're shooting one of the long, heavy barrel guns.

[boats]

I want to make sure it's legal first.

Our club we shoot regulation SB and Pistol Caliber Cowboy Silhouette I use a 39A and 1894 32/20. Long range we don't shoot a regulation match. Ours is the ram hung from chains at 200 yards al 40 shots on the Ram. Open to single shots and lever actions plain base lead bullets over 32 caliber is the match rule. Mostly I use a 12 lb 38/55 single shot but at times shoot with 9 plus pound Trapdoor. Trapdoor is OK with a 366 grn bullet out of a Raphine mold powered by 4759 in Fact Trapdoors do well in that match. Most of the 45/70 lever shooters suffer from recoil, what with sight in match and shoot off it's often 50 or 60 rounds.

However we are talking about going to the nationals this year and have bought a 45/70 Marlin cowboy off another club member in order to shoot 3 guns. I am figuring put a lead plug in the magazine tube just like on a pump shotgun, cut the capacity down to 5 cartridges, the rest Lead. Bit more in the buttstock to bring it into balance and push the weight up to about the same as my Trapdoor. I don't think there is enough wood in the forearm to allow adding lead like serivice rifle shooters do with AR's but may be able to get a few ounces that way too. A little bit more weight makes a big difference.

Going to get my scale out and figure out how much it will take. Don't want to run afowl of the equipment check though.

Boats

[Innocent]

Boats, no weight check at the nationals for cla...only sights.

Mary

[silhouette13]

man...that is a lot of gun. could always load down. one of the many beauties of this sport is speed and trajectory dont matter all that much.

a LOT of gun !

[boats]

You can load a 45/70 down but get too light and elevations are inconsistent. Our club guys will use light charges of pistol powder but they are not match winners with that combination. Optiomal for the CLA in my view is a 24 inch 30/30 but due to local club rules I can't use one. Ideal would be a 38/55 but there are pretty scarce. Ones I have found are Marlin 93's with bores that need to be relined. Find one that will shoot between now and July will give up the 45/70 for sure. Meanwhile am pouring lead.

Boats

[JohnHenry]

Boats, I asked Greg Connors about putting weight in the cowboy rifles. He said it was not a problem as long as he couldn't see it. Enough said.

John Henry

[jnyork]

Hey, boats, what is your club's problem with 30-30's?

[boats]

Couple things,

Our Smallbore and Pistol caliber CLA are on a regulation 100 meter range with stands at regular distances. Run the match from the rule book. Club High power range is dual purpose over the course Service and Match Rifle and HP Silhouette have run some BPC Silhouette on it too but lately not a lot of interest in that one. Berms out to the main back stop at 600 meters. From the shooting house to about 70 yards it's flat then drops into a deep ravine coming up to level again in front of the 200 yard Chicken line. It's a wetland and can't be altered so no way to set CLA Pigs & Turkeys. By the way Greg C often shoots our regulation HP Silhouette match.

Since the Cowboy LA match can't be regulation we shoot Rams 40 shots hung from chains and allow Single Shots and lever actions. Our club picked up the long standing match rules that a neighbor club has same swinging Rams with plain base lead bullets over 32 Caliber. We shoot there match they shoot ours. The rams are special purpose same size but not as thick so they are not so much trouble to get up from the lock boxes to hanging off the chains. You could say it's target damage but easy enough to use our regulation 500 meter rams if we wanted too. Main reason is to keep the playing field level. If we allowed 30/30's like regulation CLA they would no doubt run away with the match shooting against single shot lead bullet BPC rifles Trapdoors etc. As it is the Lead Bullet over 32 cal CLA rifles do well and have won more than once.

We shoot another hung from Chains match offhand at 300 yards with non Auto stock service rifles WW II or older. That one is 20 shots on a copy of the Army tombstone target

This has nothing do with me looking for a CLA rifle. I normally shoot the Club match with a CPA single shot in 38/55 or Trapdoor except. The ram is regulation size and when buying a CLA gun ability to shoot it in our club match gives me good practice time on Rams. No regulation CLA match in the State at all. Would have to drive couple hundred miles to shoot one. Last match under these rules was won with 35 ram hits in a shoot off, two tied for first, ties for 2nd & 4th all over 32 hits so some good shooters which breeds better shooting. I will just pratice the Chickens & Pigs on Paper targets on the 100 yard centerfire range, no way to shoot 150 yard turkeys on any of our ranges and we have 9 on the property.

Make sense ?

Boats

[w30wcf]

boats,
Regarding a lower recoil 200 meter Ram load for the 45-70, you might try a 400 gr cast bullet and 10 grs. of Unique. That's the load a fellow I know has used on the 200M ram. He would partially chamber a round raise the muzzle briefly (1 sec) to position the powder to the back of the case then close the action when the rifle was pointing down range.

I saw him go 9x10 a couple of years ago. It sure was interesting. Low report but a big "BONG"when the big bullet found steel.

w30wcf

[boats]

30 WCF

Thats a good load, up at the Faifax club who have been shooing 200 yard swinging rams over 40 years Unique was the winning load, then moved to W231 I used to load my Trapdoor with 8.4 pushing a 366 gr bullet. You had to be real consistent mounting the gun to keep the powder up against the primer and make sure the rifle was held level no cant. Most were sub sonic right from the muzzle, I know mine was anyway.

Right now sucessfull shooters in our match are using either 4759 or 4227 some use the new powders like Trail Boss. Like most clubs we don't allow the high raise and screw down into positon anymore, no muzzles above the berm. Could be that's the thing that made the Unique-W231 loads go out of favor our neck of the woods. My 38/55 290 gr bullet out of a single shot using 4759 is supersonic whole way to the Ram. Have rung 35 out of 40 with it. Add sighters 10 more shots 44 out of 50. Several of our guys have hit the same number all with single shot match rifles, no scores like that with Trapdoors. I think the best Marlin Lever score is 32. Of course it's not a regulation match so scores don't carry over to a full course 4 target match. It is very good ram line pratice

Am working on loads for the Marlin next few weeks will post the results.

Boats