Does silhouette need an overhaul?

[hermit5]

kevin6q,it wasn't magic that got those bunkers at Ridgway.Those are concrete septic tanks.they are on Ridgways HP,Cowboy and Varmit ranges.
Somebody made a motion and took on the responsibility to get it done.Instead of er,ahh,standing around.

[Kevin6q]

You are correct. I am one of those guys who just complains and expects others to do something. Drop me a note when you speed up the matches. The OP asked if silo needs an overhaul and I offered my opinion. If you don't like it, don't respond. The negativity and implied accusations I just complain does nothing to convince me to offer up help or return to shooting silo in organized matches. The OP didn't ask for unsolicited ideas to fix the activity. No need to worry about me showing up at any more matches to whine. I'll just stay home and shoot. Thanks for helping me make the decision.

[hermit5]

kevin6q,sorry you were offended.

[Another Dang 9]

Kevin6q. Which club events have you shot at?

[Innocent]

Kevin6q,
Not really intending to throw a wrench in this, but silhouette is social sport as well, attend some of the matches in the heart of the Southwest and you will see the entire family is involved, and not all of them shoot. It is not intended as a speed event.

Mary

[Kevin6q]

Thanks for the apology. I appreciate it very much.

I shot at clubs in NH and MA. All of the clubs were great. The majority of the people I met were great and extremely helpful.It was just the length of time it took to shoot a round which was the issue I have with the match.

Socializing is a big part of any activity but at a silo match I believe the catching up can be done between rounds and not during. Driving 3 hours RT to shoot for 20 minutes per round is tough to justify if there is only space for two or three rounds. To shoot more I'd jump in wherever a line was open regardless of target size or class as long as the match director didn't care. Many times I wouldn't turn in a score because I was shooting my .22 on lever action targets.

When kids attend the match they, for the most part, want to shoot and couldn't care less about the virtues of some scope, stock, politics or any of the stuff adult shooters tend to jaw about. I'd bring my two kids and they were soon bored by all of the standing around. Clubs were great taking the kids through the lines so I could shoot too but the kids were ultimately bored by the pace of a round. Take a look at the demographics of shooters at most events and there is a lot of gray hair. Yes, I know there are younger shooters at some clubs and I am making a generalization but from what I saw the meat of the bell curve is filled with older shooters.

If the sport is looking for an overhaul, speeding things up will help. A higher shoot to stand around ratio will make the activity more attractive to newbies and more importunately, youth. Activities need to change. The history of silo has been filled with change and the guys shooting long range benchrest are proof of this. Some ideas will prosper, some will fail but what is the harm in trying something new? To the credit of the clubs where I shot silo, all of them were accommodating and willing to allow people to shoot whatever they wanted as long as safety was not compromised. Clubs should feel free to experiment with differing formats and see if any of them stick. Randomly mix the animals, change distances, shoot /prone/kneeling/benchrest/whatever just to mix it up. Those wishing to remain a purist can but encourage some other way of knocking steel off the pedestals.

Just setting all 40 targets at one station will speed things up by reducing the reset times between animals. Set up 40 and the shooter has 20 minutes to drop as many as they can. 10 minutes to reset them and a round take 30 instead of 60 minutes. Twice the shooting in a given amount of time.

Are there problems with this idea. Sure, and I present the idea just as an example of what can be done to run the same per shot time limits but reduce the time for a round. The event does not become another speed event.

[Jerry G]

I have a friend that is way too bussy on Sunday to soend a half a day shooting silhouette. I guess some people just need to find another sport.

[Innocent]

Kevin6q,
While I understand what you are saying which is the kids are getting bored at matches. Maybe it is time for children to learn to be an adult, and not be entertained all the time, or better yet learn how to carry on a conversation using more than two syllable words and without using their thumbs. I do not believe that I have met you or your children, and I am not necessarily saying that this is how they behave, but I have seen many that do act this way.
I grew up attending matches with my older brother, before I was allowed to shoot (not silhouette, but 4P), I learned how to help with score keeping, how to serve food (over 150 juniors per monthly match), and any other task that was given to me by my parents or other match officials. I also learned how to appreciate quiet time in a crowd, without interrupting the event.
As a society we have leaned on the electronics to keep our children occupied while we do our own thing, rather than involving the child in adult conversation and letting them learn to think and analyze for themselves.
I guess instant gratification is necessary today, but I still find it enjoyable to take my time smelling the roses.

Mary

[GregG]

Mary, I am dumb enough to jump in to this thread again. I can see where Kevin6q just might get his nose out of shorts. We no nothing about his parenting skills or his kids. I am pretty sure each generation has said the next generation was not as well behaved as the last. Time has changed. We have to accept that and that includes all the electronic stuff we and kids use.

I agree with Kevin6q a slowly run match is painful to all. There is a difference between a well run match that move along and a match which is now. I completely understand and agree with the feelings. If it take 5 - 10 minutes to get called back to the line after everyone has returned from target setting, this is too long. I have been to those matches where I spend more time waiting on the match director to stop talking and run the match. I do not go back.

[Kevin6q]

Mary,
Seeing as you do not know me, my children, or how to avoid proving your ignorance about someone's family, I'll just stop participating beyond this reply before this sidebar to the OP degrades and potentially valuable ideas get lost. Stopping will also keep me from also prove myself another ignorant fool by hurling suppositions about others on a rather pleasant and informative forum. If you or anyone wish to tell me how my views on what I perceive as a way to overhaul silo are ignorant, out of line, brilliant, or anything else I will engage you in conversation. Now, in addition to being a whiner who does nothing, my idea about speeding up matches has me being an assumed child entertainment center complete with unfettered use of electronic devices which in turn keeps my children only answering verbally in mono-syllabic sentences unless they are texting when they are capable of using two syllable words. These insights have me convinced my initial thoughts are indeed incorrect and blasphemous. Please forgive me for having an independent thought or voicing my opinion which is what the OP asked for; "Does silhouette need an overhaul?" The activity itself, albeit a bit slow, is fine. What needs to be overhauled is the attitude of some of the participants.

Greg G, thanks for jumping in. I appreciate this very much.

With this post I'm jumping out of this thread. Say what you will but there are more important ways to make the world a better place then wasting time on the internet.

[hermit5]

Does anybody miss Kevin?

[chuckjordan2]

I can see Kevin's point of view of shooting quickly (although I would prefer a slower pace), I just don't see it working logistically. Kevin, here's why:

1) let's say the MD sets up 40 animals and a shooter shoots them. Straight following the 2' 30" timed rules (remember, setup time is excluded). This is what you are after.

2) here's the issue; the next person has to wait until you are done with all 40. So there's a 20 minute wait for that person. Now if a third person arrives the same time as the first two, he has to wait 40 minutes before shooting. So, if you have ten people wanting to shoot, I sure don't want to be the tenth person waiting for hours.

3) Schedule start times (10:00, 10:20, 10:40, 11:00, etc). People being on time? The logistics on getting people on time is nearly impossible. I'd feel sorry for the MD and the headaches he'll encounter.

Kevin, there have been others on this thread mentioning the speeding up of the sport. Have you read their posts? Please read them as you may have a similar interest.

Lastly "if you build it, they will come" Please be a MD and setup a match to your specifications, and have others come shoot. You may have something. But here's the catch, if you're the MD you'll spend the better part of the day conducting the match.

[GregG]

2) here's the issue; the next person has to wait until you are done with all 40. So there's a 20 minute wait for that person. Now if a third person arrives the same time as the first two, he has to wait 40 minutes before shooting. So, if you have ten people wanting to shoot, I sure don't want to be the tenth person waiting for hours.

What you are describing is IHMSA style match that has been done for years and years and does work. I think you have missed a major point, to just delay the match for no reason not matter the style is not fun for anyone. I have been at matches where talking is more important than shooting. Where 5 minutes of shooting turns into 30.

The best solution is a well run match that moves along not matter the style.

[Bob259]

I have no dog in this fight, but FWIW here goes;
1) Become the match director, or offer to assist him, to keep the match running at the pace you'd like
2) Not going to do something you enjoy is NOT the solution, that is becoming part of the problem
3) Ask the kids to help reset the animals to keep it going, no one would refuse that help and more hands makes things move faster
4) See Number one and number two

I've been to some matches where it runs so fast you don't have time to catch your breath between strings, that is not fun either, so be careful in what is wished for.

[Jerry G]

You are right Bob. They are not much fun.