7 BR for high power - good or bad?

[Snake]

The biggest threat to high power silhouette is low testosterone...or may just the Daniel Boone complex. A whole lot of shooters see themselves as Daniel Boone marksmen...HP silhouette will demonstrate to everyone that you ain't. Then the prospective newbee quits or just won't try because of the fear of "Daniel Boone" doing poorly. If the cost of ranges were the problem then over-the-course high power would be suffering. It flourishes instead. That's because it has the element of anonymity ...their targets are scored elsewhere and its really hard to tell what the other guy did...whereas in silhouette you're out there for everyone to see ...even though in reality no one really gives a flip what you do 'cause what I do is the most important to me.

[malinois]

I dont know about daniel boone or annie oakly but down our way we had a nice range complex mary knows it well port malibar...they quit shooting because of rounds alegedly getting out of the range after recocheting off the steel. Paper targets are cheap a good set of steel cost thousands. if some people get turned off with poor performance maybe, but cost is the bigest excuse we hear down here..land is not cheap in florida like it is else where in the counry plus we dont have natural ready made backstops like most everywhere else so we have to make really huge ones then baffle the range and have a huge amount of land behind the berms for safety..anyone that has shot orlando fl knows about huge berms.

[boats]

We have a great range well located between two major populaton centers. No problem with funds to expand the HP program. Our Smallbore rifle, Hunters Pistol Silhouette, CLA smallbore and pistol caliber silhouette programs are doing fine. As is IDPA Cowboy action High Power Bullseye 3 gun Clays etc, over a dozen ranges on the property. Main reason our HP program is faltering is lack of promotion. It's every month same time same place, if you know about it fine, only other way to find the match is off Shooting sports web site. Ever try to read Shooting sports off the net ?

No sense beating a dead horse but my view from over 20 years in Silhouette. Lack of a factory stock rifle class has been a negative. Two hot rod classes one 10lbs 2 oz any trigger other 8 1/2 lbs 2 lb trigger. It's not a good thing.

Boats

[kevinbear]

There was a heated discussion over this subject in 2/09, oddly enough I was involved in it! The discussion was over hunting class smallbore guns but is relative to the centerfire game as well. I believe a good bit of the current turndown in highpower competition is also due to economy and the higher prices of components.

Copied from that post;I mystified why rifle silhouette shooters want to take the hunting class that was invented as an introductory class and basiclly make the rifle a standard/custom gun.Talk about turning new shooters off, average Joe shows up at the range with marlin, remington,or browning after buying a relatively inexpensive target scope for it, close to 500.00 for the combo.
He thinks he has quite the rig, no one he knows as ever spent that much on a 22, he looks at the gun rack and starts asking questions.
Anschutz 54 with custom barrel = 1400.00+
Custom stock-bedded-painted =500.00
Leupold target scope = 600.00
=2500.00+
At that point he realizes these guys are all full of B.S. because these are not hunting rifles, but he shoots his gun anyway.
Now the way he figures he's a decent shot because after all he does kill a deer every year and hunts rabbits too. After a frustrating and embarrasing match he hit 9/40 targets and is convinced that if he had the money for a custom rifle he could do better. Someday I'll come back, maybe.
Build a 5000.00 standard rifle if you want, leave the hunting rifles alone, please.

[malinois]

Boats, I am glad your range is doing great. Unfortunatly driving distance kills bigbore too...other than Ridgeway i am not familiar with anybody else shooting HP east of the old miss river. Its a long drive up to PA from me. If your club begins to shoot HP it would be one more option for the shooters living in the east. What is the name of your club, I would like to keep track of it so if you do offer hp in the future I can add it to my known clubs that shoot HP.

[boats]

Way off topic but,

We shoot High Power Silhouette first Sat every month rain or shine hot or cold. Cavalier Rifle & Pistol club. http://www.cavrpc.org/ Note the HP matches are not even on the Club site. MD does not have a internet connection or email address. Only way to find it is Shooting sports or you could send me email. Nice range as good as any, better than most, not many shooters, so not much competiton in HP Silhouette.

Club Silhouette Program

1st Sat Regulation HP Silhouette 9 am. 1 PM Single shot & lever offhand CF silhouette 200 yards only club rules
2nd Sat Regulation NRA Hunters Pistol & Lever rim and Pistol caliber 9 am
3rd Sat Regulation NRA Smallbore silhouette 9 am 1pm Single shot and lever offhand RF silhouette 75 yards only club rules
4th Sat Range is in use for Regulation High Power accross the course

Gap in our program is Regulation BPCS and Regulation CLA Rifle Silhouette. If the HP program does not get energized it may be dropped for one of the two. Or perhaps split the 1st Sat morning. I know if we ran Regulation CLA rifle we would get two dozen regular shooters. BPCS too, due to time required would need it's own day.

Like most clubs real hold back is labor to run the programs. I can tell you if shooters turn out no problem with money to set up the range or targets. I get 20 smallbore and another 24 club rule match shooters on the 3rd Sat. 50 shooters 12 times a year plenty of income to buy targets, maintain the range, groom the berms buy paint etc. Starting from Scratch it's a big bite. If you promote the match, nothing complicated, just use the internet and emails to let people know the details it will grow. Also important welcome new shooters, don't be picky about first timers equipment, send prompt match results, throw in a few prizes like Turkeys November match.

Anybody want to shoot in Central Virginia & need more details let me know

Boats

[boats]

On the Hunter class and the last I will say about it.

Smallbore No doubt at all factory stock rifles are not competitive above the AAA level. I still have my box stock 7 1/2 lb scoped, Kimber 82 from 20 years ago and can tell you for sure it won't shoot with whats out there now. Next season am going to cut back on Schuetzen and get back into Smallbore serious, have a 1712 on order. Rule pushing Hunter gun is the one to have and don't know any way to get one less than 2500 bucks rifle & scope. It's just the price of entry.

Smallbore our club we have 7 regular top of AAA shooters and one Master class. Half shooting Anschutz, rest using nice rigs too. It's worth investing in the gun for the competiton, any of the 8 can win anytime. Middle of the pack, Our match have several ways to encourage and reward A & AA shooters using Factory guns .

Boats

[Trent]

There was a heated discussion over this subject in 2/09, oddly enough I was involved in it! The discussion was over hunting class smallbore guns but is relative to the centerfire game as well. I believe a good bit of the current turndown in highpower competition is also due to economy and the higher prices of components.

Copied from that post;I mystified why rifle silhouette shooters want to take the hunting class that was invented as an introductory class and basiclly make the rifle a standard/custom gun.Talk about turning new shooters off, average Joe shows up at the range with marlin, remington,or browning after buying a relatively inexpensive target scope for it, close to 500.00 for the combo.
He thinks he has quite the rig, no one he knows as ever spent that much on a 22, he looks at the gun rack and starts asking questions.
Anschutz 54 with custom barrel = 1400.00+
Custom stock-bedded-painted =500.00
Leupold target scope = 600.00
=2500.00+
At that point he realizes these guys are all full of B.S. because these are not hunting rifles, but he shoots his gun anyway.
Now the way he figures he's a decent shot because after all he does kill a deer every year and hunts rabbits too. After a frustrating and embarrasing match he hit 9/40 targets and is convinced that if he had the money for a custom rifle he could do better. Someday I'll come back, maybe.
Build a 5000.00 standard rifle if you want, leave the hunting rifles alone, please.

Kevin, you shoot an Anschutz 1712 silhouette rifle with a Leupold target scope. You may lack the custom stock... but aren't you being a little hypocritical? You yourself are basically shooting a custom silhouette rifle in the hunter class. Just because Anschutz pops it out of their factory doesn't make it anything less than that.

1712 = $1600
Leupold = $600

So you are at $2200.00 (and those are used prices)

Dude... you are a hypocrite. I think you even have a custom bolt knob!

[Jerry G]

There arn't many ranges that have 500 meters to use for HP silhouette. On the other hand, I have seen several ranges quit HP silhouette because there were only 3 or 4 shooters that would show up.

Many 'sportsmen' would rather ride their $10,000 quad in the dust and burn $40 worth of gas than spend $1,500 on a good silhouette rifle and scope. Not to mention the same costs for running their $10,000 snow machines in the winter and freezing their ass off. I'm sure there is someone out there that can explain that one to me.

They quit comming back because they only hit somewhere around 8 to 10 out of 40. What they don't realize is it takes a lot of practice to hit them tiny little critters, not a shitload of money.

[kevinbear]

Trent, guilty as charged! In my own defense I was not your typical hunter that shows up at the range, I had a custom hunting rifle and a custom XP-100 built before I ever stepped foot on a silhouette range and before my 23rd birthday! I did shoot 541's for quite a while before making the Anschutz investment.

[kevinbear]

Jerry I believe that many of the guys that do what your talking about have high pressure jobs a just want to burn off steam on the weekends while soaking in as much alcohol as posssible. Silhouette is demanding mentally and lets face it it's not exactly a wild party full of whooping hollering half naked women. Most of us are married conservative and not exactly adrenaline junkies!

Many 'sportsmen' would rather ride their $10,000 quad in the dust and burn $40 worth of gas than spend $1,500 on a good silhouette rifle and scope. Not to mention the same costs for running their $10,000 snow machines in the winter and freezing their ass off. I'm sure there is someone out there that can explain that one to me.

[Jerry G]

Kev, I agree with what you said with the except the part of the 'high stress job'.

But, so many people complain about the cost of the rifles. You can get into SB hunter for about $1,000 which is small change compared to most of the toys we buy. How about that $20k camp trailer that is used 2 or 3 times a year? I have a friend in Idaho Falls that said he couldn't afford bench rest shooting. He had a closet full of $200 to $500 guns which he didn't shoot very often. I finaly convenced him to get rid of some of them and buy a good bench gun. He did that and is hooked on comtetivitve shooting now.

[boats]

Well said,

I sold a Marlin 1894 32/20 and Bushmaster AR neither one needed and raised Anschutz 1712 price, So the 1712 is free.

Boats

[Snake]

I want t address the comment that "ricochets off the steel" and bullets leaving the range contributed to the decline of high Power silhouette.
We (at the Bench Rest Club) have empirical evidence that match bullets striking steel...break up into shrapnel bits; ricochets come from bullets striking the ground and literally being launched over back stops. secondly we have discovered that target frame backer material like cellotex etc literally provide bullets with significant deflection if that backer is allowed to develop a whole bunch of holes and hence irregular edges. Third most back stops aren't tall enough...the national standard is twenty feet and we have a whole bunch of shooters who point their loaded rifles over backstops while trying to get on target (..i never figured out why...you don't hunt like that!) and I believe they let one go now and then given the light triggers. And I still maintain that the off hand aspect creates stage fright...it ain't the expense (look at over-the course high power and bench rest..they get plenty of new shooters and they are really expensive and are generally not very accommodating to new guys.
AND I agree about opening up the hunting rifle...bad call...keeps the new kid out