In the Louisiana state CLA pistol cartridge match, I was using CCI standard velocity ammo. I hit 2 of the pigs with solid center hits and they just stood there. I did notice that pigs with hits toward the outside of the animal went down with the standard velocity ammo.

Would the 2 center hit pig ringers have gone over, if I would have been using 1200 fps or 1400 fps ammo?

Out of the PC pigs and rams, which animal is harder to knock over with smallbore ammo? Thanks Ken

The PC rams are much harder to knock off the stand reliably than the pigs. They are larger, heavier, and farther away so your bullet has less velocity on impact.

Ken Green wrote:(snip)...

Would the 2 center hit pig ringers have gone over, if I would have been using 1200 fps or 1400 fps ammo?

Out of the PC pigs and rams, which animal is harder to knock over with smallbore ammo? Thanks Ken

Ken-

IMHO (others' MMV)... When using 22LR in PCCLA class you definitely should use high velocity 40gr ammo (I'd suggest using it even in SBCR. It's not like we're looking at a requirement for "10 ring/MOA accuracy" in this game).

Center hit PCCLA pigs and rams have a habit of not falling using standard velocity 22LR ammo.... And I've seen egg layer hits on turkeys not fall occasionally as well. I wouldn't say that using high velocity on pigs will result in 100% results, but you'll certainly take way more using it than with standard velocity. If the 1400fps 40gr solid ammo we spoke of is 2MOA or better, I'd suggest using it in PCCLA (particularly on Rams, as you'll lose way more of those than pigs).

However, most of he folks I know of that switch between different ammo when going from SBCR to PCCLA use high velocity (1200ish FPS) on everything but PCCLA rams. On rams they'll use the 40gr 1400fps stuff. That way, they only have to keep track of one extra sight setting, rather than separate settings for every PCCLA target.

My .02,

- Tim

HI Tim,

Any recommendations on ammo? Using Fed Automatch with good accuracy now, but if there is something I should try....

Trying something similar with 22 Mag, a 50 grain at Rams.

thanks
chuck

ChuckD wrote:HI Tim,

Any recommendations on ammo? Using Fed Automatch with good accuracy now, but if there is something I should try....

Trying something similar with 22 Mag, a 50 grain at Rams.

thanks
chuck

For SBCR, my wife and son use AutoMatch or Federal 510s in their Henry Frontiers and I use either CCI MiniMags or CCI Tactical (they're not significantly more accurate than AutoMatch/510s, but the CCI have a 50-75fps edge in my 39A... which could be due to the longer barrel on the 39A).

The only 40gr solid point 1400+fps 22LR ammo I've found is the Aguila Interceptors, I understand Eley has one too now, but their stuff is a little pricey for my skill level. Aguila also makes a 40gr Hollow Point, as does Winchester and CCI (Velocitors). While the Hollow Point 1400fps stuff seems accurate enough at the ram, it doesn't seem to work any better for me (and in some cases, even as well) as the AutoMatch, CCI MiniMags, etc. I theorize the HPs are fragmenting quicker upon impact and not putting the same terminal energy on the target as the solids.

Regarding the 22mag; When I shot 22mag regularly in PCCLA I found the Federal 757 (50gr HPs) would take the rams over MUCH more reliably than any 40g ammo, even though theoretically the 40g stuff has more kinetic energy. But even then it wasn't 100% reliable at the rams. Al Foust's "Ramentum" theory is in play, I believe. I did find that the Hornady 45gr Critical Defense stuff was even more reliable on the ram than the 50g Federals, however it wasn't accurate enough in either my Henry H001TM or Marlin 57M, so I stayed with the Federals. Interestingly, the Critical Defense was VERY accurate out of my 10" Thompson Contender. I've heard that it shoots OK in the Winchester 9422 as well. Lastly, I quit shooting the 22mags at all when the ammo became scarce... Even though 22mag is now more available, I can load/shoot my 32mag or 357mag cheap enough.

my .02,

-Tim

I agree with Tim - up to a point.

Fed AutoMatch used to be good. It was the most accurate in my rifle. Then the .22 ammo shortage hit and bullet makers went into overdrove to try and keep up. Some of the manufacturers seemed to have lowered their quality standards to fill the demand.
AutoMatch seemed to shoot different after the rush. Perhaps my rifle got dirty, or I cleaned it better, but my 39a started shooting standard velocity ammo better. (And the result was more confidence in the bullet I was shooting and my score sent up and...you get the idea.)

Sometimes, when I don't want to pack two rifles I will take only the Marlin 39a to a match. I'll shoot SB and PC with it and shooting Norma Tac 22 has worked for me in both matches...And there is a very good chance that the animals I'm shooting are light enough to go down with any 22 hit. But, my confidence is better when I shoot ammo I know is accurate in my rifle...

another .02 cents worth.

Michael

Jeanne wanted to shoot her 22lr marlin in Pistol cartridge last summer so we did a LOT of experimenting. I had a week alone and without a car at the Whittington Center last year and shot hundreds of rounds per day.

On the Whittington center targets, I tried velociters, Mini mags, standard velocity ammo...you name it I shot it.

I think that the 1400 fps 22lr ammo isn't worth the effort for Pistol cartridge. All the ammo was accurate enough, but I think the rounds were too frangible on those targets. Mini mags did a little better on pigs than standard Velocity, and the rams were a crap shoot. I would run 8 or nine PC rams with various ammo and then reset the same bank and down only 5 or 6. I experienced the same results with the fast stuff.

For Smallbore targets I have only rang one ram with standard velocity ammo at Raton.

I believe there are way to many variables ( wind, mud, targets setters , angle of welds, etc..) to seriously consider a 22lr in Pistol cartridge at raton and definitely at our range In Oklahoma City. Our re settable targets have made even 22 mag shooters curse.

Your range and conditions may vary.

We shot a marlin .22 mag for a few years but have never been happy with it . The perfect cartridges , for us , are 32-20 and .357. I think the 32-20 at about 1100 fps is perfect...but we have both shot our high scores with our .357 cowboy.

Thanks Glen.
I can't imagine spending a week in Raton without a car. Your voluntary hardship has produced valuable information.

Michael

Mmmm. Resettable 1/2 scale target set up? Terribly interesting. Do plans exist and how much for a set of them? Thanks.

dhatch, You should visit the Phoenix range at Ben Avery. All the Cowboy/pistol silhouette targets are resettable, Big Bore, PC and 22.
Very nice, I love shooting it and it moves fast. The range is built for it with air compressors to do the lifting. Sorry it is not a portable setup.
Dennis

dhatch wrote:Mmmm. Resettable 1/2 scale target set up? Terribly interesting. Do plans exist and how much for a set of them? Thanks.

Portable/movable halfscale resetables using a pull rope are in use at Haltom City (near FtWorth) and Dallas pistol clubs and Arlington Sportsmans Club in Texas.

Here's a link to a page with pics of the Haltom City setup:
http://haltomcityrpc.org/levergun.html

Also Oklahoma City Gun club uses air resetables.

- Tim

Well then, I reckon I'll put all four ranges on my bucket lists. I won't make them all in 2017, but plan to start. Thanks.

Michael

Jeanne had to run back to Oklahoma for a few days to attend to things and I LOVED being at the Whittington center without a car. It's a week I'll always remember. I had a three wheel gun cart and we'd walk ( me and the cart ) from competitor housing to all of the ranges and just shoot all day. It made me feel like I was 12 again !

One day we ran from competitor housing to the front gate for ice. I was running back with three bags on the cart when a guy in one of those fancy 4 wheel things stopped and asked" You doing good?' and I thought he'd offer me a ride since I was on the far south road. I was sweating and huffing but managed a " I think I'm doing ok" and he said "Okay" , and just punched that thing leaving me in a cloud of dust. I made it back with about two bags !!

I LOVE that place and walking from competitor housing to the ranges gives you a whole lot more appreciation of that place.

I LOVE that place and walking from competitor housing to the ranges gives you a whole lot more appreciation of that place.[/quote]

OK - different strokes for different folks. If I go back to Raton I'd stay in Trinidad and commute to the range. But that's just me.

Thanks for the research you did.

Michael
From Rockport, where it is always sunny and the fish are always biting

Thanks for all your replies. Since I don't have a 357 caliber rifle, then I will just keep shooting my .22lr Henry Frontier. I will be using the .22 Interceptor rounds for the cowboy pigs and rams. When I able to afford another rifle, then I will probably be getting the Henry big Boy in .357 caliber for pistol cartridge.