This has probably been addressed before, but will a 125-130 gr. bullet out of a .30-30 reliably take down the rams, or is that pushing one's luck?

Paul

I tried and couldn't do it reliably, even pushing them hard. The smallest that I had good success with was the 150 Speer Hot-cor that has since been discontinued. It was tough and had a great BC compared to most other 150gr bullets so it got there a little faster than the others and delivered its momentum better. It also had less wind drift but that wasn't really a major concern for me on cowboy targets.

To update with specific data, here's the 130gr bullet that I had the best luck with, but still lost a few.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/311507 ... box-of-100

Here's the old 150gr Hot-Cor bullet that worked well.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/455628 ... box-of-100

Here's the new 150gr Hot-Cor bullet that I haven't used yet.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/133794 ... box-of-100

I use Serria 170's on Rams 125 gr Varmit bullets on the other critters. Thing about CLA rams is club to club the set is real inconsistent. If I was always shooting the same place and found 150's would do would use them.

Even 170's mildly loaded about 2000 fps can leave some, Shot out of state last year new to me club, left a bunch of rams standing. Local guys were using a lot of 45/70's

Main thing is to hit as many as possable, few Rams are left are better than low hit rate due to loads too hot.

Boats

PaulG,

A 125 will not have enough momentum to reliably knock down rams. Also they will be blown considerably by a small amount of wind. I even quit using them at the turkeys because of excessive wind drift.

Al Foust

MOMENTUM RULES RAMS LOSE!!!

Good point, easy to get sloppy on wind, Pigs and Rams so wide it's not often important. Chickens so close same thing.

Horizontal errors the Turkey is the only one you have to watch close, which means most of us don't watch it carefully.

Boats

Agreed. Turkeys are the only cowboy animals where I consider ballistic coefficient of the bullets. Those same 150s that I linked above work great due to the higher BC, but the 130gr Hot-Cor bullets have a better BC than most other bullets of 130gr or under and seemed to shoot better than anything else that I tried. Ugh.. this thread is making me want to get back into tweaking cowboy loads, and possibly picking up a new cowboy gun.

Jason,

I just ran the numbers on that 130 Speer and that is an impressive bullet.
I am shooting a new gun this year and I was committed to shooting reduced 125's and 170's. Well that lasted two matches as I lost too many rams, What I did discover though was the reduced 170's at the turkeys really work well. The wind drift in a 10 mph wind is half what a 125 gets. I have tried just about everything possible, and I really like this combo.

Al Foust

MOMENTUM RULES RAMS LOSE

Very good to know about the reduced 170's on turkeys Al. I have A bunch loaded as I was gonna use them for rams. I am gonna get A site setting and try that. Great match last week Al. I just wish you guys were closer for me. It is an expensive weekend for me due to the high hotel cost down there now. The reduced 170's is nice to shoot on rams but does NOT take them down reliably. Time to bring out the ass kicken loads again. Mike

Check out that 150gr Speer Hot-Cor bullet I linked in combination with the max load of Leverevolution powder from Hodgdon's online load data. A muzzle velocity of approximately 2512fps with that higher BC gets the very tough bullet to the target carrying a lot of momentum. I added a Limbsaver recoil pad to my Marlin 336 because I needed more length of pull and that was the only legal way to get it. It was just a bonus that I don't even think about recoil shooting that gun now.

Sorry, I don't have many rams under my belt, but the Speer 130's have worked well for me.
I shoot only one load (please use caution) Speer 130 with fed brass and primers, 32 Grs. of H322. Lee factory crimp.
Very flat load, I don't even have much of a sight change in my 24" win 94.
I hold foot on the first 3 animals, then center on the rams.
Funny thing is that many reloading books talk about H322 as a great varmint load powder for the 30-30 with the 125-130 bullets, but they don't give the load.
Dennis

Dennis,

I know you stated that you don't have many rams under your belt. I ran the numbers on your 130 using a speed of 2500 which I know is a guess, but may be close to what you may be getting. At 200 meters your "Ramentum" is 1.13. It has been suggested that a "Ramentum" of 1.20 is an accecptable number for reliable ram knockdown.

What you will probably find with your load is as your percentage of ram hits goes up so will your likelyhood of losing a few. Time will tell, and I hope you progress to hitting many each time out. Also if you shoot on more than one range you will see there are some that have more challenging rams than others. The most detrimental factor to ram success is wind blowing in from behind the rams. That situation will tell you real quick how good your ram load really is.

Al Foust

Thanks Al, Tony is always telling me the same, but sometimes, I think he is still surprised by the "magic bullet" formulas that I come up with.
I'm going out today to do a little more testing.
The problem with my load, is that even though it is a light bullet and load, it can kick like a mule.
I think it is a case of sharp recoil and not a gentle push on the shoulder.
I'll test for sure, but the load does look like a tack driver, when I sight in at 100, it is always spot on spot.
I might try benchmark or IMR 8208xr, today to see is I get the same velocity and group, maybe with less sharp recoil.
I use those powders in my other crazy cartridges ( 6 br, Grendel, Viking, etc.) they work very well, but Tony still shakes his head sometimes
Thanks for the advice, Dennis.

Dennis,

You should listen to Tony, he is a very talented and experienced shooter.
If you are experiencing discomfort shooting your 130 loads, I would slow them down to shoot the CPT's and try a 150 Speer or some brand of 170 for the rams. All that recoil will be detrimental to good shooting.
I personally don't have any 30-30 experience with the powders you are using. I have always used Varget with very good results, and for my reduced loads I use IMR SR 4759.

Al

Dennis
Do you experience any loss of accuracy shooting Varget after the 4759 or the other way around? I know that some powders don't play well together.
Thanks,
Ferret Master