I have a Remington 541-t with several mods, including a Broughton match grade barrel. When using CCI Green Tag ammo, the bolt is very hard to close. I don''t recall it being that hard to close using Lapua Bi Polar, Eley, or Wolf Match. Is this common for cetain ammo having thicker rims than others?

steveyacht wrote:I have a Remington 541-t with several mods, including a Broughton match grade barrel. When using CCI Green Tag ammo, the bolt is very hard to close. I don''t recall it being that hard to close using Lapua Bi Polar, Eley, or Wolf Match. Is this common for cetain ammo having thicker rims than others?

Yes, and CCI is well known for being hard to close the bolt on. Gunsmiths usually chamber barrels with a specific ammunition in mind, so find out what reamer this 'smith used and stay to that ammunition if possible.

BCloninger wrote:

steveyacht wrote:I have a Remington 541-t with several mods, including a Broughton match grade barrel. When using CCI Green Tag ammo, the bolt is very hard to close. I don''t recall it being that hard to close using Lapua Bi Polar, Eley, or Wolf Match. Is this common for cetain ammo having thicker rims than others?

Yes, and CCI is well known for being hard to close the bolt on. Gunsmiths usually chamber barrels with a specific ammunition in mind, so find out what reamer this 'smith used and stay to that ammunition if possible.

Thanks for the heads up about CCI. I was hoping that was not the fact as it seems to shoot pretty well in this gun and I was planning on using it for my practice ammo. Oh well, will just have to find something else, maybe Wolf or something similar. Begs the question, why are the US brands all into High Velocity and not a good, standard or low velocity ammo at a reasonable price? Must be the US Penchant for Testosterone and Super High Velocities.
Voelker is the gunsmith that worked up this gun, but I have no idea how to contact him. I had a phone number, called, left a message, no return call. If anyone has a better idea how to contact him, preferably via e-mail, let me know.

Thanks.

Steve

Brian Lee Voelker
2878 170th Ave
Ryan IA US 52330
(563) 932-2570

Some of the best inexpensive ammunition I've used is Federal Automatch, but it's also high velocity. Federal 711B is pretty good, reasonably priced and it is standard velocity, but it's pretty dry so unless you add a touch of Pam it will lead your barrel.

BCloninger wrote:Brian Lee Voelker
2878 170th Ave
Ryan IA US 52330
(563) 932-2570

Some of the best inexpensive ammunition I've used is Federal Automatch, but it's also high velocity. Federal 711B is pretty good, reasonably priced and it is standard velocity, but it's pretty dry so unless you add a touch of Pam it will lead your barrel.

Warning: When using Pam in Federal Automatch use just a little bit and remove excess with paper towels. Do not do a whole brick or use a lot of Pam and put back on the box because it will foul the powder and you will end up with a lot of miss fires. It happened to me.

Correct - there's a reason (or five) I use Eley or Lapua now.

lone ringer wrote:

BCloninger wrote:Brian Lee Voelker
2878 170th Ave
Ryan IA US 52330
(563) 932-2570

Some of the best inexpensive ammunition I've used is Federal Automatch, but it's also high velocity. Federal 711B is pretty good, reasonably priced and it is standard velocity, but it's pretty dry so unless you add a touch of Pam it will lead your barrel.

Warning: When using Pam in Federal Automatch use just a little bit and remove excess with paper towels. Do not do a whole brick or use a lot of Pam and put back on the box because it will foul the powder and you will end up with a lot of miss fires. It happened to me.

Thanks for the heads up. If I need o lube rounds, I was planning on using Hornady or Dillon Case Lube, this is what I use when reloading. That is, unless someone with more experience has reasons I should not.

steveyacht wrote:

lone ringer wrote:

BCloninger wrote:Brian Lee Voelker
2878 170th Ave
Ryan IA US 52330
(563) 932-2570

Some of the best inexpensive ammunition I've used is Federal Automatch, but it's also high velocity. Federal 711B is pretty good, reasonably priced and it is standard velocity, but it's pretty dry so unless you add a touch of Pam it will lead your barrel.

Warning: When using Pam in Federal Automatch use just a little bit and remove excess with paper towels. Do not do a whole brick or use a lot of Pam and put back on the box because it will foul the powder and you will end up with a lot of miss fires. It happened to me.

Thanks for the heads up. If I need o lube rounds, I was planning on using Hornady or Dillon Case Lube, this is what I use when reloading. That is, unless someone with more experience has reasons I should not.

I am convinced by past experiences that if you use any oil based lubricants unless you apply it just before you need to use the ammo, the left over ammo if not used right away will not be reliable and you will have miss fires.

At one time several years ago we had an opportunity to buy Federal match ammo at really good prices, less than $2 for 711, $3.50 for 900 and around $6 for Ultramatch. The problem was that it did not have enough lubrication and tended to lead barrels.

A friend of mine from Phoenix, AZ came up with the idea of mixing Lee's Alox mixed 50-50 with mineral spirits to add lubrication to that Federal ammo and I will explain the process so that there won't be any misunderstanding.

I got a small plastic container and after mixing the alox with mineral spirits 50-50 I put enough Alox solution on the small plastic box to just cover the lead, I took several bricks of ammo out of their boxes but keep them on their plastic tray, then I would deep every 50 round box one a a time for just a second, would take it out and shake the excess solution on some paper towels or old t-shirt, I would leave the ammo outside of the boxes for a while to let the mineral spirits evaporate, then I would put them back on their individual boxes and would mark the brick as lubricated with Alox. After a while the Alox would get hard but it would keep the ammo from leading the barrels on my rifles. I kept that ammo always with the lead pointing down.

The problem with the Federal Automach is that its bulk ammo and you would have to secure enough plastic trays to lubricate with the Alox solution. You would not want to put them back together bulk in their box because unless the Alox was completely dry the cartridges would want to stick together.

711B was my favorite flavor for a couple of years, but cleaning lead spirals from the bore or lubricating the ammunition as part of my range prep ritual got old. Currently I'm using up my stash of Eley, and will probably switch to Lapua when that's gone because of the support Lapua has thrown behind Silhouette in the US. A US made ammunition would be my first choice (nothing against imported ammunition, I just like to keep my neighbors employed when possible) but there's nothing ready to use from the box and I like to simplify.

I have a couple of old bricks, RWS Pistol Match bought from a pawn shop. Same thing lube has gone dry. I put it in a plastic jar spray some Balistol and roll it around. Works good but does not last. My match guns won't chamber it CLA 39A with it's loose chamber shoots it very well.

Boats

You all blow my mind as far as having to add lube to 22LR ammo. I have been shooting 22LR probably longer than all the "experts" in this forum, so far the only one that makes any sence is Lone ringer. Ammo. like auto match is not made to be used in Rifles for competition purposes. If you want to shoot cheap good ammo. you can use SK standard plus, or even CCI std. vel. at the shorter distances. Stay away from the High velocity ammo. it is good for hunting but not for Match purposes.
Funny, one of this " expert" have not shot a match or probably more than 100 rounds in the last 5 years !!!!!!!!!
Sorry, I just get pissed at some of this, out of this world advise by some ________
Evelio.

Evelio Mc Donald wrote:You all blow my mind as far as having to add lube to 22LR ammo. I have been shooting 22LR probably longer than all the "experts" in this forum, so far the only one that makes any sence is Lone ringer. Ammo. like auto match is not made to be used in Rifles for competition purposes. If you want to shoot cheap good ammo. you can use SK standard plus, or even CCI std. vel. at the shorter distances. Stay away from the High velocity ammo. it is good for hunting but not for Match purposes.
Funny, one of this " expert" have not shot a match or probably more than 100 rounds in the last 5 years !!!!!!!!!
Sorry, I just get pissed at some of this, out of this world advise by some ________
Evelio.

I'm not sure who or what you're flaming, Evelio, but nobody said Automatch was good competition ammunition, and those that have tried lubricating ammunition have said it works to a point, but is ultimately a bad idea. And for an expert on rimfire ammunition I'd nominate Steven Boelter.

Bob
I have never claimed to be an expert in rim fired ammo. and as far as Steve Boelter, I don't remember him saying or writing anything about altering the lube on any 22 ammo. he is an expert in testing out of the box factory ammo.
For the last 10 years I build nothing but silhouette rifles, and I think that their accuracy is more than addequate for the game. About 3 years ago, I started shooting 22 benchrest matches, USBR and ARA and that is when I really found out about what kind of accuracy can be obtained from a 22 LR rifle.
This guys, some of the best in the nation, use the ammo right out of the box, and yes they use pretty good ammo, but no nonsense about changing the existing lube, checking rim thickness, or weighing the rounds. They have top of the line rifles, and equipment, and as said before good out of the box ammo.
This go back to what other more known " competitive" shooters on this forum have said time after time, you have a $2,000.00 or $3,000.00 rifle, spend a few hundred dollars in gas, and lodging, and then shoot cheap ammo. ????? an expect to do good !!!!!
My advise as the others said, " spend an extra 3 or 4 bucks in good ammo.and you be surprise how good your rifle will perform"
Evelio.
PS By the way, don't go to a pawn shop or Wallmart to try to buy good ammo.

Evelio Mc Donald wrote:You all blow my mind as far as having to add lube to 22LR ammo. I have been shooting 22LR probably longer than all the "experts" in this forum, so far the only one that makes any sence is Lone ringer. Ammo. like auto match is not made to be used in Rifles for competition purposes. If you want to shoot cheap good ammo. you can use SK standard plus, or even CCI std. vel. at the shorter distances. Stay away from the High velocity ammo. it is good for hunting but not for Match purposes.
Funny, one of this " expert" have not shot a match or probably more than 100 rounds in the last 5 years !!!!!!!!!
Sorry, I just get pissed at some of this, out of this world advise by some ________
Evelio.

Evelio, some shooters have experienced ringing 1/2 size rams in both Hunters Pistol and SB Cowboy Lever Action Rifle Silhouette using standard velocity ammo and have tried HV ammo instead, granted the accuracy is not as much a concern to them as is the ability of the ammo to knock down the targets. A lot of my Cowboy shooting buddies use inexpensive hv ammo and do very well with it one of them won the last NRA Regional I attended using Aguila ammo with a score of 75X80. You would also be surprised to see how many Cowboy Lever Action shooters use the Federal Automatch ammo even at Nats.
I myself stick with using Lapua Center X, Midas Plus and sometimes Scoremax with 48 gr bullets for sticky rams 1/2 size rams.

High velocity ammunition is pretty startling to other shooters, so just out of courtesy to everyone else on the line it's good to stay with standard velocity.

When I started seeing lead on cleaning patches, nobody had an explanation. I was using Federal 711B, pretty decent ammunition, and it took awhile to suspect there was a problem there - experimenting with adding some kind of lubricant showed me that lube makes a huge difference in performance, as measured in accuracy and consistency, and just a touch of lubricant eliminated the leading problem. Based on this I switched to Eley and that set of problems just went away.

There are several reasons that lubing ammunition is - in my opinion - a bad idea. It has to be prepared just before use or, as Lone Ringer noted, the lube will contaminate the powder, and that's just one more thing on a match day or - worse - on the road. Repeatability also suffers because you probably won't have exactly the same mix or dose from one time to the next, and after all the time and expense to minimize other variables it is silly to introduce variables at the last minute.