Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Centerfires, rimfires, pistol cartridges and everything in between.
reddnekked
Unclassified Poster
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2014 9:17 am
Location: Usually at the range, but wife likes it when I eat at home

Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by reddnekked »

Hi, I'm new to the forum, and I've been learning Lever Action Silhouette for the past two years.

Do most of you use cast bullets or jacketed bullets?
What is the lightest weight that is effective in 30-30?

Thanks,
I am Reddnekked
glen ring
Master Poster
Master Poster
Posts: 1084
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 3:04 pm

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by glen ring »

We use both. Jeanne shoots a 170 grain cast bullet in her 30-30. I shoot jacketed bullets in mine..I have used bullets that weigh from 100 grains to 180 grains, but I like a 150 grain or 170 grain bullet.
Just Be Nice **==
User avatar
snaketail2
AAA Poster
AAA Poster
Posts: 738
Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 8:55 am
Location: Rockport,Tx

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by snaketail2 »

Cast bullets are a lot easier to find and we don't need to drive them very fast - so Cast for me.

FYI: The "Map of Silhouette Ranges" is very out of date. I would suspect there are many more clubs with Cowboy Silhouette matches, but they aren't listed. I'm currently looking into "Cowboy Action" events to see if there is anything I can shoot for practice. Where do you shoot?

M
PS: I got red-naked twice - I won't mix beer and schnapps again. I woke up naked on the couch- to the sound of my wife was laughing at me. (The 2nd time wasn’t funny at all.)
Overheard at the Dairy Queen "I live in Port Aransas,but I'm not from here...you can tell because I have all my own teeth."
44 mag
AAA Poster
AAA Poster
Posts: 535
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 6:28 am
Location: Bradford, PA
Contact:

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by 44 mag »

Jacketed for me 125 grain on chickens 150 for pigs and turkeys and 170 for rams. All 3 are very accurate if I do my part.
User avatar
snaketail2
AAA Poster
AAA Poster
Posts: 738
Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 8:55 am
Location: Rockport,Tx

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by snaketail2 »

44mag- are you using the same sight settings for all three bullet weights/target distances?
I still haven't decided if I want to use a 170gr ranch dog bullet for all targets or use 130gr bullets for C/P/T and 170s for rams. I'd like to keep the sight adjustment to a minimum.

M
Overheard at the Dairy Queen "I live in Port Aransas,but I'm not from here...you can tell because I have all my own teeth."
User avatar
Jason
Uber Master Poster
Uber Master Poster
Posts: 3002
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2006 7:36 pm
Location: Snohomish, WA

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by Jason »

All jacketed for me:
  • Chickens: 110gr Carbine Bullet (Hornady, Rem, Speer, whatever)
  • Pigs, Turkeys: 130gr Speer Hot-Cor (2007)
  • Rams: 170gr Speer DeepCurl (2042)
Now if I could just get off of on-call duty for work and out of family obligations so that I could actually get to shoot a centerfire cowboy match this year... :roll:
southpaw
B Poster
B Poster
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2009 6:45 pm
Location: Wenatchee WA

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by southpaw »

Hey Jason,
Come join us at Tonasket Gun Club May 10th. Shooting PC & 22 next 5 months. I use jacketed 180 gr. in 44 mag in PC & long range.
Leroy :)
User avatar
Jason
Uber Master Poster
Uber Master Poster
Posts: 3002
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2006 7:36 pm
Location: Snohomish, WA

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by Jason »

The centerfire cowboy match up at Custer is May 10th. If I can somehow break away for a match that day, that's probably the one that I'll go to. It's only about an hour and a half away from home. I might be up for heading over to Tonasket once to check the place out. It's four and a half hours of driving each way, though, so won't be making it very often.
44 mag
AAA Poster
AAA Poster
Posts: 535
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 6:28 am
Location: Bradford, PA
Contact:

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by 44 mag »

Snaketail2 I do adjust my site for each animal. It is not much of a adjustment to go from one to another. A guy I shoot with uses 170 grain on all targets he just uses a reduced load on c-p-t and it works out well for him.
User avatar
snaketail2
AAA Poster
AAA Poster
Posts: 738
Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 8:55 am
Location: Rockport,Tx

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by snaketail2 »

I just got back from the range. I was testing 30-30 rounds with 135 and 165gr cast bullets vs 110 and 150 jacketed bullets in my 26" Winchester 94,

The rifle had been previously sighted in (Williams receiver sight) with (Factory) Winchester 150gr FP at 50 and 100 yards - so I warmed up with 5 shots at 50 yards - group size was about 1/2" and I was happy with that.

First came the 135gr FP over 20gr of 4227 at 50 yards: No recoil issues with this load. However, I could not find the target. The state run shooting range supplies 8 1/2x14" targets. No matter where I held the sights I made no holes in the paper!

2nd was the 135 gr FP over 7gr of Unique: Again no recoil issues, almost non-existant. Tight group about 5 inches right of the factory loads.

3rd was 165 over 27gr of 3031: More felt recoil, but easily manageable. Shot high - about 6 inches high at 50 yards

4th was the 165 over 30gr of Lever Revolution: Recoil felt the same as 3031. Very smokey load. Could not find the paper. Held center, all 4 corners...nothing. It was going bang, but I never did find any evidence of a bullet strike*.

the 5th was the 100gr jacketed bullets: I don't recall the powder or load - these were some rounds I used to shoot in my 14" Contender. The only reason I shot them was to get the nickel cases back...again found no holes.

Based on these results I plan to shoot chickens and pigs with the 135s over 7gr of Unique, then switch to the 165s and 27gr of 3031 for turkeys and rams. The local match is later this month - I'll post my results.

*The state run shooting range is covered concrete area and an angled metal backsplash at 100 yards. The target holders are full of holes - so no help there, couldn't even shoot it in the dirt to see where it was going. The range is only 100 yards, so I'll have to dial in Turkeys and Rams at the pre match sight-in.

And, just for fun I tried a 120gr 32-20 cast bullet over 7gr of Unique in the 30-30 case. It make a sound like a balloon popping and went somewhere downrange - nowhere near the paper target.

The factory loads shoot very well in my rifle, but would beat you up pretty badly in a match. I can see I have a lot of load development to do (I'm lucky - thats exactly what I like to do!)

So Reddnekked - If I can find the target I'll stay with cast bullets, if I can't find the target I'll get my fly rod out and go fishing.
M
Overheard at the Dairy Queen "I live in Port Aransas,but I'm not from here...you can tell because I have all my own teeth."
boats
AAA Poster
AAA Poster
Posts: 626
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:59 am
Location: Virginia

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by boats »

Snaketail

My observation on Light Unique loads is they are position sensitive. We had a father son team shooting the same rifle using Unique at our club matches. Spotting for them was very obvious the Dad mounting high and screwing down like High power shooters like to do strikes were higher than the Son who picked the gun up and shot level. I ran some test same two methods with my Marlin 1894 38/40 which had been using Unique and found the same, two different groups on paper depending on how the gun was handled.

Went to 4227 and could not see any difference in how it grouped due position. It’s best to always mount the same anyway just something to watch out for. I shoot mostly single shots and 4227 is the match winning powder by far, based on that alone almost all my Lever loads use 4227. Exception full power jackated 30/30 170's = Varget

Somebody else may see it different.

Boats
cedestech
Distinguished Master Poster w/Palms
Distinguished Master Poster w/Palms
Posts: 2324
Joined: Sun May 08, 2011 3:06 pm

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by cedestech »

What are ya'll loading 165/170 grain cast at? I just ordered a bunch to try.
Emmett Dibble, Houston, Texas. Where's my buddy Jason? Keeper of electronic records and banisher of little pieces of paper?
User avatar
snaketail2
AAA Poster
AAA Poster
Posts: 738
Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 8:55 am
Location: Rockport,Tx

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by snaketail2 »

OK Boats - I'll give 4227 another try. When I was loading the first batch with Unique I double charged one case - I answered the phone, and when I hung up I thought I'd better check it...sure enough it had a double charge.

I'll try 4227 again with the 135 boolits.

I'll load 165 and 170gr cast bullets with 27/28gr of 3031. The powder drought may be ending, but supplies haven't caught up to us in the middle of the county - 3031 I can find.

I don't have a crono - but I think the 165/170s are running about 1800/1900fps.
Overheard at the Dairy Queen "I live in Port Aransas,but I'm not from here...you can tell because I have all my own teeth."
boats
AAA Poster
AAA Poster
Posts: 626
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:59 am
Location: Virginia

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by boats »

I don't think you can double charge a 30/30 case with 4227, overflow instead but it's worth checking. my 38/40's won't hold two charges if it. Two other advantages to 4227 it meters well no need to weigh. And more important it's been available in my area during the powder shortage while Unique is impossible to find. Unique is a very useful powder I use a lot of it just not as good for rifle cartridges as some others.

Our local shop got in a good supply of the old Dupont numbers few weeks ago 3031 4064 4198 etc, could be things are opening up.

Boats
dgslyr
B Poster
B Poster
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 6:02 pm
Location: Northwest Texas

Re: Cast or Jacketed bullets?

Post by dgslyr »

I use 110 gr. sierras RN in my 30/30 for CPT @ 2300 FPS with Reloader 7 I'm under the starting load about 4 grs.I use 170 gr. Sierra's on the rams @ 2360 FPS using Leverevolution because I rang to many rams at 4 different ranges with 150's.I shoot the same load in both Marlins.I tried to get cast to shoot for a while.I used an Ideal/Lyman 311041 sized .311. It out shot the Ranch Dog and Lee 170 moulds I have easily.Used 22 grs. of Reloader 7 for around 1750 FPS less then 2 inches sometimes around 1 inch at 100.Something bad happened between pigs and rams because the groups went to about a foot and a half at 200.If I drove them faster they only got worse.This is with an alloy as hard as Lyman #2.My friend had the same experience with his Marlins.Neither his nor my rifles,4 altogether, have microgroove rifling.Mine are both 1 in 12,his are 1 in 10.Best guess is the bullets were to long to be stable after they slowed down.Or maybe not ,don't know.My fiend got acceptable groups at 200 with Linotype bullets driven 2100 FPS.I just shoot my 38/55 with .381 diameter Hunters Supply bullets or Lyman 375296 sized .381 at almost 1400 FPS and use jacketed in the 30/30.The Marlin Cowboy 38/55's with the right size bullets are very accurate Mine has done 3-4 inches at 300.Almost as good as my Rolling Block 45/70 with Swiss 2F.
Post Reply