Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

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44 mag
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by 44 mag »

We had people fly in for the Pa States this year and had no troubles with the guns. He did have to ship his ammo because you can only have 11 pounds of ammo on the plane.
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by Innocent »

I fly as much as 12 times a year for matches all over the country. Yes packing can be a hassle, but rarely do I have any serious issues. Now because CLA is three gun, yes there will be some challenges but even when I shoot it in Raton I usually carry two rifles and borrow the third.
Ammo is limited to 11 pounds, but again that is subject to the mood of TSA so shipping is an option. Again if you borrow 22 for smallbore then all you have to find locally is 22 ammo, not usually a serious problem. As for hosting in PA, I'm for it as much as I love Raton and the facilities there, the movement across the country allows for a wider group of persons to attend.

Southwest has been the best with regard to flying with firearms, any problems are with TSA and ignorance on their part.

Good luck Mike and Tammy and great offer!

BTW FWIW, I have found that 10 hour drive is about the breaking point expense wise for drive vs. fly.

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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by JohnHenry »

I have travel by air several times to matches and brought my rifles along, too. I can get three rifles in one gun case, all packed in separate cloth cases. I pad them real well. The case weighs 47 lbs. The limit is 50 lbs per item of luggage or there is an upcharge. I usually fly Southwest since they allow the first two bags free. The ammo weight limit is 11 lbs. like Mike said. I don't bring any ammo with me. Instead, it is shipped ahead to the match director or a friend.

So far, I've had little or no problem. Just make sure the rifles aren't loaded. I double check that twice before I pack them. Usually, rifle cases are unloaded separately at the baggage claim. An attendant brings them to you and you have to show a baggage claim receipt to claim the rifle case. One time the gun case didn't make it home with me on the plane. They failed to load it. The airline wasted no time locating the case and even delivered it to my house. It had been loaded on another flight to my same destination.

All the same, every time I travel with a rifle case I am immensely relieved when they bring it to me at the destination.

Jim Luke
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by GregG »

That is the problem with the match being held at either end of the us.

For Texas it is just 23 hour drive, for CA 38 hours. So for me a three day match becomes at least 4 days of driving. I understanding wanting the match in your back yard, but not for me. And to say everyone is for it is well 3 - 4 different posters, does not seem like a majority.

I for one hope it stays in the mid US.
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by tealdawg »

I don’t recall seeing any posts stating that everyone was for it, so not sure where the majority came from

All that is being asked is the chance for it to be placed on the silhouette committee’s agenda. Other silhouette disciplines hold Nationals at various locals why not CLA
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by 44 mag »

I know that everyone is not for this change. My feeling is we need to make some changes in all of Silhouette not just locations. We are pushing this for the shooters and the sport. Just as it takes the western shooters a few days to go east it takes us eastern shoots a few days to go west. I would think that real shooters would like to shoot at as many different clubs as they can. I know for me I love going to different clubs as well as different parts of the country. Also we have a good group of shooters from New England states that could benifit from this. Just my 2 cents. Mike Haynes
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by boats »

Hold it in Pennsylvania match will be top quality, lot of shooter turn out, with very good competitors who don’t often shoot the Nationals. That's a good thing. Small-bore and High Power have benefited from alternate East and West matches.

Lobby your Silhouette committee representatives, it’s their call.

Boats
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by GregG »

My latest reply was lost somehow so I am going to try again.

Other than for personnel reason why would a change in venue help silhouette as was implied. The previous post stated moving silhouette nationals to PA benefited the matches shot there. Ok than means it can be quantified, so how? As I recall the numbers in attendance are no larger than the other location. So how has silhouette benefited?

Another previous post is we need to change some things for silhouette. Ok great there have been threads on this before but how does a move the nationals help my local club in "where ever"?

Many sports, I have shot or watched for many years have tried this with the same results. It does not fix broken as was implied. Ok unless there is something wrong with the location or range.

As Boat's requested, I for one will send a letter to Greg and make sure all the location shooters here do also. Leave what is working alone.
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by tealdawg »

By giving other parts of the country the opportunity to host the Nationals, shooters who can not afford to make the trip to Raton due to time or financial reasons can participate in a National Match.
This was never meant to be a permanent change but why can it not be done the same as high power, small bore and hunter pistol
No matter where they are held it poses an inconvenience to a large portion of the shooters, travel is involved plain and simple. The Eastern portion of the country holds a very significant shooter density, is it any less important than any other place in the country?
I have read the comments about travel through unfriendly states; REALLY, something is drastically different about going through those same states going west?
To keep this sport growing it is important to retain the existing shooters and attract new shooters and giving the Eastern portion of the country an opportunity to do this could help achieve that end.
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by lone ringer »

The way the NRA has run other silhouette disciplines has not help attendance to National matched and rotating the locations has only damaged the sport as a whole. One of the things they do wrong is that they send programs/entries only to people that attended a Championship the previous year so if the match was in PA only those people in attendance will get a program even if the next match is going to held at another location. By doing it that way every year less and less people get programs/entries.

In order for a match to be successful it needs to develop a tradition of place and time like Camp Perry, Conard Cup, Southern Nationals, Nogales International ( the last two no longer held but lasted well over 20 years) etc. And it is my opinion that the only reason the Cowboy Lever Action Rifle Silhouette Nationals have been successful is because they have not changed its location or the time frame when is held.

Raton is the only facility the NRA has access to that is more or less centrally located and going there does not involve more than two days drive for any one. I read this East and West thing but the truth is that Raton, NM is well over 1000 miles from some of the Western states where some of us that attend the Cowboy Nationals live. We have been getting around 150 shooters to the Cowboy matches and only one year we had less because of the front fiber optic fiasco, other than that the numbers have been steadily climbing since the first National was held in 2004. I would hate to see the number of shooters drop by half for the benefit of the ones that are not able or willing to travel to Raton.

I have no ax to grind, have nothing but respect and admiration for Mike and Tammy for their efforts, always had a great time the several times I was in Ridgway, PA. This is the only post that I am going to make here on this matter but know that there are a lot of other shooters that share my views and are also sending their letters to the silhouette committee. Tony Tello
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by 44 mag »

Tony, I have the utmost respect for you also and I thank you for your input. This will aslo be my last post on this subject. We will let the commitee decide. Some people that coment on these topics have no idea what is going on and should travel a bit to see what it is like to shoot at other clubs as well as other parts of the country. I have travled to Raton as well as many other states and I am sure I will travel to Raton again(maybe 2014) to shoot. It is a nice place but I can garentee you,you will be treated alot better by the staff at MCRC than you get treated in Raton. Ok I am done ranting about this we will wait and see what happens. Mike
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by glen ring »

I have found most shooters are really good folks no matter what the venue. We love Raton and go to the matches as a cheap vacation two or three times a year. We like sitting on the porch of competitor housing and watching animals . The rooms are cheap and we cook our meals. We have been back east a few times and didn't like it. I know we would not go to Pa.
Good luck in your pursuit . I know you are working hard and I hope if you get the Nationals they will be a success.
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by GregG »

Thanks Tony.... You did an excellent job of describing my feeling. I think any central location is great for the match. The extremes CA, and PA are bad too.
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by AMB »

Changing venues will have no effect on the growth of CLA one way or another, and Raton will never be Camp Perry. By not rotating it the only ones positively affected are those with in easier driving distance and those who disdain change. Leaving it at Raton essentially still keeps it a regional match, simply call it the “South West Region”. The losers are the large groups of Shooters in other parts of the Country who can’t for whatever reasons make the trek. The only reason to oppose rotation is Self – Interest, and that’s ok, it’s your choice as a citizen and competitor. Personally I would love to see it move, give more people a chance to compete in Nationals while the game is still around. Let it rotate anyplace that has the facilities and people power to handle it, NW, SE etc.

And if it doesn't rotate, I won't stomp my foot and say I won't go, I'll try just try and make it when I can. Al Bean
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Re: Change in venue for 2015 CLA Nationals

Post by cedestech »

Both cases have their merits and the merits for both are very valid. I know from organazations I have particapated with in the past some make travel consesions for people
traveling substantial distance. Just a thought.
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