Marlin 1894 - .357 or 38 Special...?

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Merlin
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Marlin 1894 - .357 or 38 Special...?

Post by Merlin »

Just picked up a 1894 CB 24" and, of course, I am doing searches all over the internet trying to decide what to load for it... For those with the Marlin 1894 38/357...

Do you have better luck/performance with 38 or 357 brass?

Are 357 power levels needed to shoot pistol cartridge matches? Ever?

I see a lot of people talking about the Hornady 125 xtp... I have shot Precision Black Bullets made in Kemp TX in all of my handguns for years with great performance... Are coated bullets used by many shooters?

Thanks for all the posts on powder choices, looks like just about every kind and brand of powder is being or has been used in the PC rifles...
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Re: Marlin 1894 - .357 or 38 Special...?

Post by Tlee »

Merlin -

Definitely want to use 357 brass. 38sp works "just ok", in my experience... About 3-4 MOA with most loads that shot 2MOA in 357 cases, iirc.

I've 2 of those rifles and I found any 125-160gr jacketed or plated will shoot well with a variety of shotgun/pistol powders. With a 125gr I've had great luck with 4.5 to 5.5gr of 700x, GreenDot, HP38/W231, and Unique. Best groups with 125g were if I kept them 1000 to 1200fps. Low recoil and I've never lost a PCCLA target with them at that speed. They'd still shoot 2MOA if I bumped them to 1300-1400fps, but that's not required for PCCLA. Seems like the 125gr starts opening the group up running them any faster than that. I have shot 158-160gr to over 2000fps into MOA groups with LilGun though. That's overkill for PCCLA (and it damages targets), but works well for CLA out to 150yard turkeys.

I've also shot 158gr to 205gr gas checked lead projectiles very well with those same powders. That 1:16 twist really loves heavier bullets.

Regarding Plain lead, a few years ago tried pretty much every commercially available lead projectile with the above powders, along with 3 or 4 others, but best group I could get was about 8"... At 50 yards. I did try one powder coated 158gr, but it didn't shoot any better for me. Perhaps there are better ones available now.

Other's and your mileage may vary...

My .02,


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Re: Marlin 1894 - .357 or 38 Special...?

Post by cedestech »

Agree with Tim, if it's a 357 chamber, use 357 brass. If you use 38spl you will have a extra .10" of freebore. It may still shoot fine but odds are in your favor with the 357 brass.
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Re: Marlin 1894 - .357 or 38 Special...?

Post by frankmako »

go with the 357 brass. it does better in the action when loading a round. i tried some 38 sp brass but could not get the group to close up. must be the different in the distance/size length between the two before the barrel rifling. i use 38-158 fp plated x-etreme bullets with a very lite taper, no crimp. i run the 158 gr at 964 fps, per my chronograph. i also used x-etreme 38-125 fp and they are the same as the 158 gr except they run at 1064 fps. i tried some dardas 158 gr cast lead at just a little over 1,100 fps. they shot great but i would have some lite leading after shooting 50 plus rounds. i use sr 4756 powder. i drop the same powder weight for all three. i like to keep it simple stupid (k.i.s.s.). when i run out of sr 4756 i am going to unique powder. they stopped making sr 4756 and i down to 7 pounds. best group i can get off the bench with the rifle locked down in the rest like bench rest shooting is, all most one hole at chickens and pigs. at turkeys it opens up around one inch or less and rams about one and a half inch or less. this is from hand drop powder weights. when i load from the dillon the groups open up some, but not much. dillon powder drop is all ways just a little high/low/or just right at each pull. i can get great groups off the bench, different story when i am standing.
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Re: Marlin 1894 - .357 or 38 Special...?

Post by Tlee »

frankmako wrote:go with the 357 brass. it does better in the action when loading a round. i tried some 38 sp brass but could not get the group to close up. must be the different in the distance/size length between the two before the barrel rifling. i use 38-158 fp plated x-etreme bullets with a very lite taper, no crimp. i run the 158 gr at 964 fps, per my chronograph. i also used x-etreme 38-125 fp and they are the same as the 158 gr except they run at 1064 fps. i tried some dardas 158 gr cast lead at just a little over 1,100 fps. they shot great but i would have some lite leading after shooting 50 plus rounds. (snip)....

Frank -

Which diameter Dardas did you try? They offer them in 357, 358, and 359. I tried the 358 with a good half dozen different powders on a ladder test but could not get any of them to group well at all. I picked that diameter as the gas checked lead that shoots well for me in the 24" Marlin are 358.

Also, regarding SR4756... That was one that I tried with lead but I found Unique and W231/HP38 to perform about the same. Never tried SR4756 with jacketed or plated, but with all the other powders I've tried, I'd expect it to be pretty close to those two along with GreenDot and 700X.

Another to consider is WSF... When I switched to a longer barrel on my T/C 22Hornet I started getting primer flattening issues with my favorite W231/HP38 load. I changed to virtually the same load in WSF and all my pressure signs went away. Plus I found the WSF loads to be much more tolerant of powder drop variances and primer type/brands. I'm also using it in 32mag for the same reasoning. Haven't tried it in 357mag yet as I have more 700X and GreenDot available that I use in it.

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Re: Marlin 1894 - .357 or 38 Special...?

Post by frankmako »

tlee, i used the dardas 357 bullet in the .358 size. they grouped good across the animals. i would have stayed with them except i got the leading in the rifle. checking my load data the load ran 1,002 fps in the rifle, but gave me leading. that load is the load i use in hunter pistol silhouette but with a different 180 gr cast lead bullet. they run slower in the 10 inch t/c barrel, so no leading. i should have work some more with the load and run them slower,,,,,but the plated loads came together fast. so that the way i went. also the plated bullets are/were cheaper than the lead bullets. on the sr 4756, i started using it in 1980 for cast lead pistol silhouette loads. no reason why i started with it, except everybody in west texas during those day were using it for pistol silhouette. when it runs out i am going to unique, unless if i find some more. i have found sr 4756 works well and cast lead, plated or jacked bullets. sr 4756 makes nice easy shooting loads. unique does the same and that is the reason i will use it next. what i have found unique and sr 4756 run about the same. working up loads can take time, but pays off in the long run. just today i ran some new 357 loads using sr 4756 across the chronograph trying to improve on what i have. they ran slower, but the rain came in so i was unable to put them on paper. it has got to group or it is a no-go.

last year i worked up several loads with unique for the 44 mag that i used in pistol cartridge. i found out my old 44 mag loads (2400 and/or H110 w/ speer silhouette 240 fmj and 270 gr gas check home made cast) that i used in conventional long range standing pistol silhouette ran 1,557 fps and 1,485 in the marlin 1894. still under factory loads, but hard on me. group great, but more than what i want to shoot. the load is 1,351 fps and 1,302 fps out of the ruger super blackhawk 10 inch. so i worked up lite loads for pistol cartridge. now i am reworking the 44 mag loads for big bore cla. working/making up loads is part of the game, you got to find what your gun likes. i got two marlin 1894, one 1980 model the other a 1970 model. they like different loads.
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