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Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:44 pm
by cedestech
Merlin wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:14 am
If there are enough silhouette shooter to matter
THAT....

A lot of people, especially on this forum seem oblivious to the fact that silhouette is a very tiny slice of the shooting sports pie...

:|

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:51 am
by Doodaddy
Merlin wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:14 am
The rifle appears to be a really nice effort but aimed (yes I know I am not punny) in a different direction than Silhouette. In a different stock with a different profile on the barrel and it might be an off the shelf contender. I would think that discounting the rifle because you don't like the magazine is perhaps a little narrow in the thinking. Who knows, If there are enough silhouette shooter to matter Begara might move the mag guide rail over to a more standard rimfire location and create or adapt a more "conventional" magazine to fit the rifle. They show more than one magazine/bottom metal configuration in their product line. Or just put a single shot adapter in the gun when you restock....

Speaking of triggers... Rifle trigger upgrade options. Jewell, Bix n Andy, STL, TriggerTech Diamond, Calvin Elite, Timney, Rifle Basix for this rifle seems like a huge plus. IMO only the very top of the line Anschutz "might" improve on a couple of the triggers I listed.The barrel making process on the Bergara rifles seems to be on a par with even the custom makers. https://www.bergara.online/us/barrels/ . With a Premier HMR Pro type stock with attention paid to the weight of the rifle.......?

Another thought.... I have personally and know of many who buy an Anschutz barreled action to get the action and trigger. New barrel and stock before the gun is used.... If this is a ~$1,000 dollar gun buy it - sell the stock to a TT guy and use the R700 purpose built action. Add a Jewell or a Bix and Andy and a (name your own) custom barrel on it and come out cheaper that using an Annie or just about any other custom action as your build base.

Just some thoughts to consider. My .02..... :wink:
This is exactly why I posted the rifle. It could very easily be a great gun at lower prices than the Custom/Anschutz route. Especially if they sell the barreled action and if a nice single shot adapter comes around.

I have no intentions of buying and building one; I've already built my ideal silhouette rifle. However if this rifle had been out at the time, it would have at minimum given me pause. I'm not saying Bergara and Stiller are comparable, but saving a significant amount of money is not negligible lol.
cedestech wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:44 pm
Merlin wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:14 am
If there are enough silhouette shooter to matter
THAT....

A lot of people, especially on this forum seem oblivious to the fact that silhouette is a very tiny slice of the shooting sports pie...

:|
A sad truth. Image

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:15 am
by pdeal
You know I try real hard not to speak badly about other shooting disciplines. Most of them I don't have any interest in but to each his own. This is after all a silhouette forum and it is reasonable that people here might view this rifle as an outlier in this context.

I think it would be real good for those of us who really love silhouette to try to be good ambassadors for the sport on this forum and the numbers should grow. It is a lot of fun after all.

As far as a good basis for a silhouette rifle I really think there are many good ways to start, many much cheaper than this rifle.

I do agree that the 700 platform has the advantage of many good triggers.

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:45 am
by Doodaddy
pdeal wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:15 am
As far as a good basis for a silhouette rifle I really think there are many good ways to start, many much cheaper than this rifle.

I do agree that the 700 platform has the advantage of many good triggers.
Oh for sure there are many cheaper options. In fact, if I could shoot a single stage trigger as well as I can a two stage trigger, I would have never "upgraded" from my 541T Sporter that I paid $550 for. It has the best single stage trigger I've personally pulled and is nearly as accurate as my Stiller. Many rifles have a good single stage trigger and are accurate enough out of the box for this game...CZ,Remington,Savage,Tikka....oodles and oodles.

It's the two stage trigger that starts to muck up the market. If CZ wouldn't have botched the Fly trigger so badly, they would be the first and last stop for any new silhouette shooter in my opinion because they would then have a good single and two stage trigger available, a good stock option, accurate, and affordable. But alas, here we are and just as cedestech mentioned, the silhouette group of shooters is a small group compared to the rest of the shooting sports and there really isn't a need to cater specifically to us at this point.

The appeal of this Bergara is that it fits in a 700 stock and takes 700 triggers. Assuming it's accurate enough and makes weight in the right stock (I question that it can with the factory barrel (I don't know the weight of that factory stock)....if it doesn't, this rifle really loses appeal almost entirely for silhouette), it's about the cheapest way you can step into a good two stage trigger that I'm aware of. One could argue the merits of the KIDD two stage trigger on 10/22 rifles being a low cost option, but I don't believe it belongs in the conversation when comparing Anschutz and 700 style triggers. It is "ok" at best to me.

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:56 pm
by Another Dang 9
The winner of HR at the nationals at Ridgway was shooting a Ruger 77/22. Just saying...

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:19 pm
by Merlin
Another Dang 9 wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:56 pm
The winner of HR at the nationals at Ridgway was shooting a Ruger 77/22. Just saying...
I daresay that is an In Spite of it being a 77/22 rather than it being Because of it being a 77/22..... :lol:

Just guessing but around here it is about 90% Annie with a smattering of custom actions and a few of whatever else...

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:21 pm
by Doodaddy
Another Dang 9 wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:56 pm
The winner of HR at the nationals at Ridgway was shooting a Ruger 77/22. Just saying...
And Steve Prefontaine won races in homemade shoes, but that's not really the point either lol. Of course it's the Indian and not the arrow, but that doesn't disqualify discussion of arrows. What else would we talk about?

Besides, the MSRP of a 77/22 is within $150 of the Bergara so it's not like the Ruger is some ultra budget option. It's a nice rifle with limited trigger options. If they work for a shooter, fantastic I say!

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:02 pm
by dustinflint
Another Dang 9 wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:56 pm
The winner of HR at the nationals at Ridgway was shooting a Ruger 77/22. Just saying...
No. He was shooting an Anschutz 54.18 Frankenhunter.

Dustin

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:41 pm
by Hawkeye7br
They didn't make this rifle for us. they may not even know we exist, or if they know about us they don't care. This rifle was made as a practice option for the PRS or F class folks, with a nod to the NRL shooters. Some of these disciplines have a 2# minimum trigger, while others allow "any safe trigger".

In any discipline, when shooters become complacent and don't regularly support their local matches, they run the risk of killing their own sport.

The same logic applies to local club membership. Rant over.

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:56 am
by Merlin
No one makes a rifle for "us." There are a few rifles with Silhouette in the name but does anyone actually shoot them in a match? Or perhaps I should say does anyone actually shoot them once they figure out what the hell is going on.... If people could buy an anschutz action with a trigger - or bare - I would guess that very few silhouette shooters would buy a complete Anschutz rifle. The huge majority of HP Silhouette shooters buy an action and then the pieces to have it put together by a smith,,,,A very sizeable percentage of smallbore shooter do the exact same thing.

As to shooting ourselves in the foot and choking the life from our sport - is it happening right now? In 50 years of shooting I have shot nearly a dozen various disciplines and one of the most common things I have found is an attitude of snobbery to any other sport or people who don't shoot the same sport or the same overpriced gun or the same brand of action or barrel or scope or ------- Hell, I have even been called out over having cheap shooting glasses while trying to fit into the (deleted) games. When shooters get the elitist cliquish or snobby attitudes attendance will decline and the sport shrinks or vanishes. Want to help the sport - talk to the guy who comes up and looks and try to keep a pleasant demeanor to people who might be interested.

Just my opinion as a mediocre never be a master shooter. :ympeace:

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 3:44 pm
by Another Dang 9
Dustin not in HR. In standard maybe. I'm referring to Matt Pavlik. Couldn't remember his name when I posted that.

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 3:52 pm
by Another Dang 9
Merlin I agree about no one makes a gun for "us". (Unless you shoot cowboy) but HP and SB does (kind of) "make" us build custom guns because we are all nuts about having the absolutely best there is. I will say I shot better with my stock bare bones factory gun (A Ruger) than I do with my souped up custom gun. Sometimes it is the Indian not the arrow.

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 12:44 pm
by Varn
Another Dang 9 wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 3:44 pm
Dustin not in HR. In standard maybe. I'm referring to Matt Pavlik. Couldn't remember his name when I posted that.
I'm pretty sure that Luke Johnson won SB Hunter rifle with an out of the box Savage Anschutz 54 Sporter. Matt Pavlik does shoot very good scores with his 77/22 though.

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 2:14 pm
by dustinflint
Varn wrote:
Fri Nov 01, 2019 12:44 pm
Another Dang 9 wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 3:44 pm
Dustin not in HR. In standard maybe. I'm referring to Matt Pavlik. Couldn't remember his name when I posted that.
I'm pretty sure that Luke Johnson won SB Hunter rifle with an out of the box Savage Anschutz 54 Sporter. Matt Pavlik does shoot very good scores with his 77/22 though.
John Mullins won the SB Hunter Rifle National Championship with an Anschutz 54.18 Frankenhunter. I had a front row seat while he beat me in the shootoff.

I also had a front row seat while Luke beat me in the shootoff for Standard Rifle.

Rifles in smallbore silhouette are almost completely a personal preference thing. There are many that can do the job. As long as the rifle is accurate and has the right fit, balance, and trigger for the shooter it's good. Put some Lapua ammo in it and go.

Dustin

Re: Bergara B-14R 22LR

Posted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 2:59 pm
by Another Dang 9
Dustin. I believe you're correct. Matt won master class but not the match. The awards ceremony was an event in itself.